Jewish Unity Live: An analysis

A few commenters wrote in to say that I was completely wrong about Jewish Unity Live being disingenuous. So let's do some research and see what we find. Jewish Unity Live (JUL) lists the following organizations as its 'partners':

1. Phoenix Community Kollel
   
2. LINK The Los Angeles Intercommunity Kollel
   
3. Jewish Education Center of South Florida
   
4. Atlanta Scholars Kollel
   
5. JET (Jewish Education Team) (Chicago)
   
6. St. Louis Kollel
   
7. Torah Links (Lakewood)
   
8. Jewish Education Program (JEP) of Long Island
   
9. JET (Jewish Education Through Torah) (Ottawa)
   
10. Providence Community Kollel
    
11. Dallas Area Torah Association (DATA)
    
12. The Seattle Kollel
    

Let's have a look at each of these organization's mission statements and see whether or not it is disingenuous.

1. Phoenix

'Whether you're Reform, Conservative, Orthodox, unaffiliated or somewhere in between, the Phoenix Community Kollel is your most vibrant source for Jewish learning in the Valley of the Sun. Through study opportunities in various formats and locations, the Kollel brings a new dimension to everyday Jewish life.

Led by a team of dynamic rabbis, the Phoenix Community Kollel gives you the tools to connect timeless Jewish traditions with modern life. You'll learn in a nurturing environment as the rabbis open their minds to impart wisdom. In addition, the rabbis open their homes to share Shabbat, and their lives for personal family celebrations. By uniting fellow Jews through shared joy in religious education and Judaic tradition, and by extending a friendly, upbeat, non-judgmental invitation to all Jews. The Phoenix Community Kollel is building bridges in our community. '

Non judgmental? But doesn't every member of the Phoenix community kollel passionately believe that Reform and Conservative Judaism are treif, Reform Rabbis are 'Tinok Shenishbah' at best and Kofrim at worst? Phoenix, please explain the 'non judgmental' thanks.

2. Los Angeles (LINK)

'LINK is dedicated to creating a true Makom Torah which will serve as a beacon of light emanating from Westwood. In addition, we are committed to heightening Jewish pride and identity through a large number of creative programs and educational initiatives.

Our mission is to help interested Jews become observant and Baalei Teshuva become Bnai Torah. Whether one is reform, conservative, orthodox, unaffiliated or somewhere in between, LINK is their most vibrant source for Jewish learning.'

OK, at least they're honest about their goals.

3. South Florida

'The Jewish Education Center of South Florida is an organization committed to spreading Jewish awareness. The Center is a base that provides Jewish education on all topics ranging from spirituality to current events. It is a place where Jews young and old, singles, students, and married families of all affiliations can come to connect with their heritage through classes, lectures, seminars, and retreats.

The Jewish Education Center of South Florida is a non-affiliated organization where Jews can learn about their heritage through lectures, classes, and seminars. We provide quality Jewish education that is relevant to modern life. All who attend our events are respected for who they are. They are assisted in conducting their own quest at their own pace.'

Jewish Awareness? Not quite the whole truth I think. A non affiliated organization? Oh please. Completely 100% affiliated with Yeshivish Orthodox Judaism.

4. Atlanta

'Whether you're Reform, Conservative, Orthodox, unaffiliated or somewhere in between, the Atlanta Scholars Kollel (ASK) is your most vibrant source for Jewish learning in Atlanta. Through study opportunities in various formats and locations, ASK brings a new dimension to everyday Jewish life.

Led by a team of dynamic rabbis, ASK gives you the tools to connect timeless Jewish traditions with modern life. You'll learn in a nurturing environment as the rabbis open their minds to impart wisdom. In addition, the rabbis open their homes to share Shabbat, and their lives for personal family celebrations.

By uniting fellow Jews through shared joy in religious education and Judaic tradition, and by extending a friendly, upbeat, non-judgmental invitation to all Jews. ASK is building bridges in our community.'

Non Judgmental? Building Bridges? How can an organization composed 100% of Yeshivish Chareidi Jews claim to be non judgmental bridge builders, when by their very definition they cannot possibly sanction any Jewish movement apart from Orthodoxy, and even then they hardly hold of MO. Wait a minute, this is the exact same blurb as on the Phoenix site! Hmm.

5. Chicago

'an independent, non-profit outreach organization that provides Jewish educational programs at DePaul, Loyola, Northern Illinois, Northwestern, University of Chicago, UIC - Chicago, University of Illinois - Urbana/ Champaign and other campuses in Chicago. Our flagship program is a comprehensive 10-week course in basic Judaism, run twice a semester.'

'We aim to inspire, energize and educate Jewish college students so they can develop a stronger connection to their Jewish heritage, the Jewish people and the land of Israel; to instill pride in the vitality of the Jewish mission; and to create Jewish leaders.'

Not bad, but again with the 'independant' line. Independant of what exactly?

6. St Louis

'The St. Louis Kollel is an association of young dynamic Jewish scholars who have come together to share their knowledge of Jewish tradition with the general Jewish public in St. Louis. Each of these dynamic individuals has spent many years immersed in the study of Talmud and a plethora of other fundamental Jewish classical texts.

They have been brought together by a shared commitment to the values of community and education, both central tenets of our rich heritage. The Kollel provides an opportunity for all Jews to experience Jewish concepts in an engaging and stimulating environment. Participants are welcome regardless of previous Jewish educational experience.

Aware of the time constraints many face in demanding work environments, the scholars teach in homes, offices, local community facilities and even outdoors. The group consists of thirteen married couples who function as a team in order to fit the needs of the entire spectrum of the Jewish community.'

Sounds nice. They fit the needs of the entire spectrum of the Jewish community! I wonder if they tell anyone who isn't Orthodox how they're following the wrong path, and won't get as many Olam Habah points.

7. Torah Links

Unclear what exactly they are from the main site, but the Monmouth branch has this to say:

'Monmouth Torah Links is a not for profit organization, dedicated to raising the level of Jewish awareness and education in the Monmouth County area. We provide a wide variety of educational and social events designed to create a warm and non-judgmental environment for Jews of all ages to explore and experience their heritage. Our programs are open to all Jews, regardless of their education or religious affiliation.'

Again with the non judgmental! This is simply not true. If you're not following Orthodoxy, then you're not following the one true path. What could be more judgmental than that?!

Let's see what Middlesex County Torah Links has to say:

'Whether you're Reform, Conservative, Orthodox, unaffiliated or somewhere in between, Torah Links of Middlesex County is your most vibrant source for Jewish learning and living in Middlesex County. Through study opportunities in various formats and locations, and dozens of religious and social events Torah Links brings a new dimension to everyday Jewish life. Led by a team of dynamic rabbis, teachers, and mentors, Torah Links gives you the tools to connect timeless Jewish traditions with modern life. You'll learn in a nurturing environment as the rabbis and teachers open their minds to impart wisdom. In addition, the rabbis open their homes to share Shabbat, and their lives for personal family celebrations. By uniting fellow Jews through shared joy in religious education and Judaic tradition, and by extending a friendly, upbeat,  non-judgmental invitation to all Jews, Torah Links is linking Jews to their heritage in our community. '

Hmm, same kind of blurb. Seems like these guys all read from the same prayer book.

8. Long Island

No mission statement.

9. Ottawa

'JET is dedicated to providing Jewish education and inspiration to adults and families. We offer a wide variety of classes, lectures, and programs for Jews of all backgrounds, on all levels from beginners to advanced.

Our classes are offered throughout the city, including the Soloway Jewish Community Centre, community synagogues, and in private homes. Many of our classes are initiated by people who wish to enhance their knowledge of Judaism and are held in their homes.'

More deliberate vagueness. 'Jewish education and inspiration'. Not a word about Orthodoxy.

10. Providence

'The goal of the Kollel is to enhance and enrich Jewish life in and around Providence RI. This will be accomplished by providing relevant and stimulating educational programs that appeal to people regardless of age, background or level of observance. Strengthing Jewish Identity Through Learning.'

Not bad. Not a word about Orthodoxy of course, but a lot less disingenuous than some of the others.

11. Dallas

Know more. Live better. Find happiness. Learn with DATA.

If you’re thirsting for knowledge about your Jewish heritage, interested in boosting your “spiritual fitness,” or simply seeking other Jews who are at the same place in their lives as you are, DATA is for you. 

Through classes, special events, and the popular Learners’ Services on Shabbat and holidays, DATA rabbis offer you the opportunity to rediscover the richness of your Jewish heritage and much more.

The Torah. The Prophets, The Sacred Writings. This is the remarkable heritage of Judaism and, by the way, also much of the foundation of Western Civilization. But a word of caution: these texts are complex and difficult to understand without the help of trained scholars. That’s where Dallas Area Torah Association comes in.

DATA is a vibrant resource for Jewish education led by outstanding rabbinical teachers and scholars. No question is out of bounds and lively discussions are a hallmark of DATA programs.

DATA offers a rich learning environment in an atmosphere of warmth and informality. It is more than just classes and study. It is a community. DATA embraces every Jew – regardless of religious background, or lack of it. Whether it’s a lively Shabbat meal at a rabbi’s home or a quiet discussion with a DATA rabbi over coffee, you can have a personal connection with DATA.

Take us for a test drive. It could be one of the most rewarding, and important decisions you ever make.

The Dallas Area Torah Association is a non-profit, independent Jewish Learning Center. With its main center west of Preston/Forest in North Dallas, plus satellite centers in Far North Dallas and Plano, an Israeli branch, and college program, DATA offers Jews of all backgrounds and affiliations the opportunity to explore and rediscover their Jewish heritage. Through exciting classes, special events, and the popular Learners’ Services on Shabbat and holidays, DATA offers you a variety of free or low-cost ways to learn and enjoy the company of folks who are looking for the same thing. 

Attend a DATA program, service, or class and you are likely to find Jewish adults ranging in age from the late teens and 20s to 60+ and from every background –from Reform to Orthodox to unaffiliated to everything in between. They are drawn to DATA not only by the content but by the engaging, thought-provoking, yet warm and inviting atmosphere. DATA is more than a learning resource. It also is a community of Jews who love being Jewish and who welcome all who share that passion. Any Jew who wants to spend a Shabbat or holiday in the company of other Jews can contact a DATA rabbi and be assured of finding a place where they will feel welcome.

DATA also is known nationally as the Flagship of the Kollel Movement. Through the Dallas Kollel – a center for the advanced study of The Torah, Talmud and other Jewish texts – DATA trains the next generation of rabbinic teachers and scholars who will serve Jewish communities far and wide. These rabbis and their families will greatly enrich our community for the years that they are with us. 

Oh boy, where do I even start with this infomercial?! I'll just pick on one line - 'DATA embraces every Jew'. Of course they do! As long as you embrace their Orthodox fundamentalism. But if you think Conservative Judaism is the correct derech then you're out of luck. They can't recognize your marriages, your conversions, they may not even drink your wine. But they'll embrace you! They'll even gladly take your money. Just don't offer them a drink.

12. Seattle

The Seattle Kollel is a Jewish community organization of Rabbis who live in Seattle and are working to strengthen the quality of Jewish education throughout the Pacific Northwest. They teach classes in a variety of settings from Synagogues to Starbucks. The Rabbis who make up the Seattle Kollel pursue advanced studies in the afternoon, and are available mornings, at lunchtime, evenings or weekends for teaching and outreach programs.

The Hebrew Root of the word Kollel is Klal, which means group or community. The Seattle Kollel is funded, organized and operated by the local community. The Kollel offers a wide spectrum of study and discussion opportunities in locations from Vancouver, BC to Eugene, OR; from Port Angeles to Yakima.

Programs are offered for Jewish men, women and children of all backgrounds and affiliations in a non-judgmental atmosphere. Whether you are just learning the Aleph-Bet or are studying advanced Talmud; whether your interest is in the basic tenants of Judaism or you are working through the deeper aspects of Jewish philosophy, the Kollel’s combination of group and one-on-one learning can help you connect to Judaism in new ways. The Kollel also organizes hikes and other social events for fun and learning.

Again with the 'non judgmental' nonsense! But at least they offer hikes.

Conclusion

I think it's pretty clear that almost all of these institutions seem to be spinning the same shpiel:

1. Emphasis on learning, not observance
   
2. Emphasis on how it's open to all Jews, Reform, Conservative etc & is independant
   
3. Emphasis on being non judgmental
   

Is this disingenuous? Of course, and here's why.

1. Learning, not observance

Please, nobody is out to create Maskilim here. The obvious and only real end game is to create Observant i.e. Orthodox Observant people. The gameplan is that through the learning, people will get connected, start coming for shabbos meals etc, and eventually get hooked in. So why does only one of these sites (lA) explicitly mention that their goal is to get people to be more observant? Why does every other site talk in vague terms about 'awareness', 'culture', 'heritage', but never 'observant' or 'Orthodox'. Why? Because they are being disingenuous.

2. Open to all Jews / Independant

Each organization stresses how it is 'non affiliated' or 'independant'. And of course not one site EVER mentions the word Orthodox. Why is this? Again, it's all part of the disingenuousness. They don't want to scare people off with the truth, at least not at first. Pretend to be a generic organization of do good Rabbis with NO AFFILIATION to anything except our heritage. Technically, there is no umbrella Orthodox association like there is in Reform or Conservative, so technically they're not exactly lying. But looking at the bios of all these Rabbis it's abundantly clear that every single one of them is Yeshivish Chareidi, ranging all the way from Ohr Someach to Lakewood, and every yeshivish Chareidi stop in between. 100% affiliated with Yeshivish Orthodoxy. Guaranteed.

3. Non Judgmental

Almost every site emphasizes time and again how 'non judgmental' they are. Of course this is partly to counter the 'perception' (reality) that Orthodox Jews are judgmental, and partly to make people feel at ease with something different. But the reality is that Orthodoxy by definition IS Judgmental, it HAS to be. Orthodoxy, even Modern Orthodoxy cannot accept pluralism. cannot accept kefirah, and has very strict lines on what is 'allowed' and what is not. It's as simple as that. Calling yourself 'non judgmental' while subscribing to a fundamentalist worldview of the Yeshivish variety is the height of disingenuousness. 

Now please don't get me wrong. I know many people in these kollels and they are good people. I'll even be dan lekaf zechut and blame it all on the marketing departments. But please, a little more honesty in advertising. Don't pretend to be 'non affiliated'. Don't pretend it's all about 'learning'. Don't pretend to be not Orthodox.

Los Angeles wins the honesty competition here, followed by Providence for brevity. Dallas loses big time for exuberance bordering on Informercialism. 

Atlanta and Phoenix get penalized for copying each other's blurb word for word, and claiming to be 'building bridges'. I know people in both kollels and they do a lot of good work, but they aint building any bridges, that's for sure. At least not any two way bridges, which is kinda the point in building bridges, no? 

I mean, if they were truly serious about building bridges between the Reform, Conservative and Orthodox movements, then surely the kollel should sponsor events whereby the local Conservative Rabbi gets to lecture on his ideology to the frum community. Wouldn't that be fair?

So is that going to happen? Somehow I don't think so. And if you believe it will, then boy do I have a bridge to sell you. A one way bridge of course.

Kiruv Ethics

I am a fan of kiruv. It's true, I'm not kidding. I think that if you have a worldview that you think is correct, then it's perfectly fine to try and convince other people of that, to be 'mekarev' them to your point of view. It's a free world, and the marketplace of ideas should be vibrant and open to all. However, there are certain basic rules and principles that should be obeyed.

1. Free Speech

Debate works when people are allowed to air their ideas and ideologies freely. When people are restricted from speaking or sharing their ideas, persecution, lack of freedom and even atrocities are not far behind. Kiruv organizations and individuals are perfectly welcome to try and persuade other people to become Orthodox Jews, Moslems, Atheists, Jews for Jesus or whatever, using whatever bogus arguments they wish. However all opinions must be allowed to be aired. Shutting someone up with cries of 'kefirah', or issuing Fatwahs, is not allowed. Frum Kiruv organizations might pretend to be non judgemental and tolerant in this regard, but in reality, being Chareidim, they cannot be. Nebuch a kofer is also a kofer as they are wont to say.

2. Honesty about Motives

The second rule is that the kiruv organization must be honest about its motives. It cannot pretend to be pluralistic when it in fact it isn't. It cannot pretend to be offering free trips to Costa Rica when in fact there is an agenda. Frum Kiruv organizations are often guilty of some level of disingenuousness here, as I posted previously.

3. No brainwashing

Even if an organization allows free speech and is honest about its motives, there is a third requirement. The tactics that the organization uses to try and persuade people must be ethical, and not involve any type of brainwashing techniques. The line between intense persuasion and brainwashing is somewhat blurred. Sleep and food deprivation can be considered brainwashing techniques, but they could also just be a natural part of some intense program. For the most part, Frum Kiruv orgs don't use such tactics, though maybe some NCSY weekends come close.

4. Respect for other people's right to have beliefs

You probably thought I was going to say respect for other people's beliefs, but I don't neccessarily agree with that. What if someone has highly objectionable beliefs? Do you have to respect that? I don't think so. Rather, you must respect their right to hold that belief, but you don't have to respect the belief itself. It's a fine line which is difficult to navigate, but you have to try. In my experience, Frum Kiruv Workers pretend to be tolerant of other people's right to have different beliefs but in reality are not tolerant, since at their core they are fundamentalists.

5. No mockery

Persuasion tactics should involve reasoned debate (and experiential activities as long as they don't cross the line into brainwashing), but should not include mockery of opposing positions. Of course I am guilty of this on the blogs, but in real life I fully agree that this is not the best approach. A classic example of what not to do is R Dovid Orlofsky's famous tape on Torah & Science. True, he's very funny, but it's just not appropriate. Orlofsky style tactics are in widespread use by similar Kiruv Clowns, but I think the average Kiruv Kollel guy is more straight up than that.

6. Not in your face

I don't think kiruv should be pushed on anyone. Everyone has the right to privacy, or to be left in peace with their own ideas (unless of course these ideas are clearly dangerous to others). I don't believe in going up to unsuspecting people and haranguing them about my ideas, and neither should Frum Kiruv workers. And for the most part, they don't.

7. Fair Play

If you propose to try and be mekarev others, then you must allow other people to do the same. In general I see some hypocricy here. Kiruv Organizations  perform all sorts of stunts, but if Jews for Jesus try to missionarize they get condemned in the worst possible ways. What's the difference? In a similar vein, a  blog which talks about how terrible Atheism or Conservatie Judaism is gets a free pass, while skeptic blogs are reviled for 'spewing kefirah' and trying to posion the minds of innocent believers. You can't have it both ways.

Anyways, with these guidelines in place, I think kiruv is not only permissible, but actually desirable. Progress comes from the market place of ideas, from vigorous debate and discussion. I therefore plan to increase my own kiruv efforts in this regard. So far I believe I have successfully mekareved quite a few people to my point of view, and be'ezras Hashem will continue to have such hatzlochoh in the future. Based on my experiencesin the kiruv field so far, I believe there are a lot of overly-affiliated uyet vaguely dissatisfied Jews out there who only need a small push and some education to find the true meaning in their lives.

Was I right about Gaza?

It's certainly looking so based on the recent news reports. Everyone is now saying the Gaza operation didn't achieve very much. Hamas have already started to rearm, the international assurances are worthless and Hamas are declaring victory. The whole thing was a political ploy by Olmert and Livni to show how tough they can be, and even that didn't achieve its goals, since recent polls suggest that Netanyahu gained more from the whole thing than Livni did. The people in the South aren't happy either. It's no big chiddush to bomb a defenceless population with smart bombs, the chiddush would have been to take out Hamas, but Israel didn't get anywhere near that goal, they didn't even engage. A complete waste of time, which only achieved international condemnation of Israel, more hatred, a strong possibility of revenge attacks, war crimes allegations and possible trials, and of course the deaths of hundreds of innocent children.  Oh yeah, I can already hear the reponse of the Zionfanatics - 'Well, we had to do something'. Yeah, good job guys, you really did do something.

Kiruv Cons

One thing I find distasteful about modern Kiruv organizations is the way they market themselves and their products. They typically shy away from using the word Orthodox, and for example present their lectures as just being about 'Judaism', rather than "Orthodox Judaism'. They try and sound all pluralistic, which of course isn't true in the slightest, because they'll hit you full force with Orthodox Judaism every time you really get into it with them. 

[Update: To double check, I just logged onto one of these kiruv Kollel's web sites. Not a word about Orthodoxy, but plenty of lines about 'uniting fellow Jews ' and 'building bridges in our community']

In fact I was recently talking to a kiruv player in one of these kiruv kollels and he told me how he doesn't like to call himself Orthodox, rather he describes himself as just Jewish. This might have been somewhat believeable, had it not been immediately followed up by a conversation where he wondered if a Conservative Rabbi could be meztaref to make a minyan. So much for pluralism.

Another example of disingenuous kiruv marketing is the annual 'Jewish Unity Live' event, put on by a handful of kiruv oriented 'community' kollels. The organization's mission is to  'build jewish unity through learning', and hosts a lavish affair each year, typically honoring some majorly rich secular Jews for being benefactors. Yet all the major players behind this organization are RW / UO style kollels, whose only possible conception of unity is for everyone to be Orthodox, and preferably Yeshivish / Chareidi Orthodox. These people don't even hold of the Modern Orthodox, never mind Conservative or Reform. How can they possibly claim to be building Jewish Unity? I guess if we're all being conned into donating money to the kollels, then that could be a pretty unifying experience.

The whole thing is very clearly geared towards getting wealthy, secular and guilt ridden Jews to donate money to the kollels.The one excuse they have is 'caveat emptor'; If the big movers and shakers of the secular Jewish world want to give their money to organizations like this, then I guess it's entirely their own fault. I bet you don't see Michael Steinhart getting fooled though.

Another perhaps more well known example is the Oorah 'Kars4Kids' program, where the ads on the radio talk about helping kids at risk or in need, but the entire program is really about OJ kiruv. This one was so disingenuous it made the national news. 

I suppose I shouldn't be too surprised though. Since OJ Kiruv is inherently all about selling falsehoods, it makes sense that the methods they use to to raise the money to sell the falsehoods should be pretty dodgy too.

Now don't get me wrong. I do think that these Kollels do some good work, and their people are good people. I just think they need to be more upfront and honest about what it is that they are REALLY selling, and what their goals REALLY are, and what they REALLY think about unity with Conservative & Reform. Or even the Modern Orthodox. Yes, it might not be so attractive to potential BTs or secular mega-donors, but at least it would be honest.

Sliding to the left: A post for my dear wife

My wife just came back from a ladies night out very upset. She believes that in our Modern Orthodox community, there seems to be a slow decline in religiosity. Friends of ours who used to be quite RW MO now seem to be LW MO, if that. One woman now doesn't cover her hair and wears jeans (gasp). Another woman complains bitterly about Taharas Hamishpachah. Given a choice of schools, one Modern Orthodox and one not quite Orthodox, many members of our shul seem to be opting for the not quite Orthodox, despite the fact that the Modern Orthodox school is just as good academically. And then of course there's me, and all the other husbands who also think just like me (which turns out to be a remarkably high number of us, including Rabbis). What's going on? Is this unusual, or typical?

I think it might be a combination of factors. Firstly, I think it's natural that, outside of Lakewood, as people get older the passions of their youth start to die down a bit. People who 'frummed out' in Israel, who got married covering their hair, as they get older and the pressures and lessons of life come to bear, start to be less concerned about such things.

Secondly, I have always maintained that the demographic in our MO community is more 'left' than 'right'. True, we have some world class YU Rabbis, but the majority of the congregants are more left. Not that there's anything wrong with that. I don't think this is the case in the average shul in Teaneck, but I think it is the case in many other parts of the country.

Meanwhile, in the local chareidi community, things don't seem to be much better. A long time black hatter, takes off his hat, takes his kids out of the Torah True school and announces to the world that he and his family are no longer religious. Some of the BT's  who so enthusiatically embraced the evangelicals (Kiruv Clowns) in their younger years are now older and wiser, and bitter. Of course the frummies continue to get frummier, but I'm talking about the average person.

Is this the same in your neck of the woods? 

Or are people going in the opposite direction and my community is an aberation? Or is this just a coincidence? Or maybe, my wife is actually upset about something else entirely (I can't imagine what) and is just transferring her displeasure to this issue. Before you all laugh hysterically, she did insist that this was about the community, not me. And before you all point fingers at me, nobody in my community, except confirmed kofrim, read my blog, so I can't be to blame for this slide to the left.

I think age might have a lot to do with it so I would appreciate responses from the elderly more mature members of the community.

Finally, I hate to see my wife upset. So this might be the one issue which does get me to change my tactics.

[I am XGH's wife and I approve this message.]

To bash or not to bash, that is the question

Rav Aaron Shechter, Rosh Yeshivah of Chaim Berlin, calls Science & Torah reconciliation 'stupid'.  Harry Maryles calls this video clip 'depressing', though what's even more depressing is Harry's next line: 'That people are willing to ignore or deny their own minds betrays the intellectual honesty that is the hallmark of Jewish thinking.' It's mind boggling to me that the Modern Orthodox can look at the extreme intellectual dishonesty and blatantly obvious religious bias of their Chareidi counterparts, but think they themselves are immune. I often think that on this issue, the Chareidim are actually less intellectually dishonest than the Modern Orthodox. 

On the other hand, I was reading a philosophy book this weekend, which made the point that skepticism about reason and knowledge has a long and distinguished philosophical tradition, going back to the ancient Greeks, and that many philosophers over the ages have said don't worry too much about true and false, but rather worry about right and wrong, good or bad. In other words, don't worry (about the truth, since it's unatainable), just be happy. And there is something to be said for that, since people who are sure they have found the truth, whether atheists or fundies, can be quite scary.

On the other hand, where would be without evidence and reason? How can we argue against Holocaust deniers, for example,  if we ourselves are not scrupulous about historical truth? On the other hand, life is short and seemingly meaningless, so if a religious fantasy life keeps people happy and slightly more moral, then why not? So I probably shouldn't bash the MOs, even though they deserve it. On the other hand, just like its ok to kill civilians in Gaza for the greater good, surely it's ok to bash religious fundies for the greater good - an end to religous fundamentalism. On the other hand Jewish religious fundamentalism is fairly harmless (except in Itamar, Hebron and Ramat Bet Shemesh). On the other hand, it's a slippery slope to atrocities once you can believe in absurdities. On the other hand only Fundamentalist Christianity and Fundamentalist  Judaism have the balls to fight Fundamentalist Islam. On the other hand, maybe if we all focused on evidence and reason Fundamentalist Islam wouldn't exist in the first place. On the other hand, people seem to need to believe in something, better they believe in harmless strains of religion rather than something which could be far worse. On the other hand, we should strive to evolve to a better state than that. On the other hand, there's not much chance of that happening.

Ouch. My brain hurts. Maybe I should take my cues from the Rosh Yeshivah and bash away. Or maybe I should bash very, very softly. Or maybe I should just change the subject already. I'm not sure. But one thing I have decided - I'm no longer looking to construct a brand new theology, there are plenty of those out there, from Louis Jacobs to Sherwin Wine, no need to re-invent the wheel. I guess all I am after is seeing if the big tent of Orthodoxy can accomodate people who commit to Halachah but don't believe anything much. I think with some creative hashkafah it probably can, and my reasons for wanting that are purely personal. Where there's a Rabbinic will there's a hashkafic way I always say. 

But Gil & company don't seem to want to do this. Gil writes that 'he would object strongly to a prophetic DH believer being in an educational position within Modern Orthodoxy'. ROFL. The names I could name! Gil will sure have a lot of objecting to do. But don't worry, I'm not about to out anyone. It's really not worth it. Life is short, I think the most important thing is to celebrate life in the most positive way, stand up for truth and justice, and mostly be happy. If people want to live a religious fantasy life, and they're not hurting anyone, maybe we should just let them be. Of course we certainly shoudn't promote it, but maybe we shouldn't try to tear it down either. 

Or maybe we should? Tzarich Iyun Godol.

If you liked my views on Gaza, you'll love this

Defiance ... or Paranoia?

Tonight I went to see 'Defiance' with my wife, the movie is about the Bielski partisans who saved 1200 Jews during the war, by hiding out in the forests. My wife's grandparents actually hid out in the forests during the war in that part of the world, I'm not sure if they were with the Bielski's or not, but they had very similar stories, even having a 'forest' wedding.

After watching the movie, my dear wife said 'This is exactly why we can't show any mercy to Hamas', which ties in neatly to Avram Burg's new book 'The Holocaust is over, we must rise from it's ashes', which is trashed by Efraim Zuroff here.

Burg, who no doubt some will say has gone completely OTD and is now a self-hating Jew, says that Israel is completely over the top paranoid about the Holocaust, and can't make sensible decisions regarding the Arabs etc, because they are living in fear of another Shoah, or alternatively are consumed by the idea that while Europe's Jews mostly went like lambs to the slaughter, they certainly won't.

This same theme appeared in my Rabbi's speech today. He went to Israel this week along with 20 or so other Rabbis on a mission to give support to the Jews in southern Israel. He described movingly how much the people there were suffering, and how we must remain strong, and we will survive etc. Not a word about the incredible carnage being visitied on Gaza though. 

But, since no one seems to agree with me (at least no one connected with the Orthodox world), I can't tell if I'm right or wrong. Of course all morality is subjective, so maybe there is no right or wrong here, but I also get the sense that maybe, due to thousands of years of continual vicitimhood culminating in the Shoah, we are now unable to tell anymore whether or when we are the victims, or the agressors.

I'm all for stopping the next Holocaust (though Israel is as likely to trigger it as it is likely to save us all from it), and have no illusions that such a thing could never happen again. Just wait till the global economic meltdown and another Bernie Madoff (or even just the first one). It could easily happen again. But still, I'm not sure that bombing the heck out of Gaza is the way to go.

Also, the political angle here seems quite obvious. Olmert stops the attack a couple of days before the inauguration, claiming 'victory', in a move clearly designed to put Hamas on the political defensive. 

But how is this victory? Olmert says 'all of our goals have been attained', but is this really true? They are still firing rockets, and surely no one thinks that Hamas has none left, or couldn't easily get more if they wanted to (despite Egyptian assurances which are worthless). 

Olmert says (about Hamas) 'Many of its members have been killed'. Yeah, they killed about 400 Hamas fighters (though a good number of those were just policemen). Before the fighting started, the reports were that Hamas had 20,000 men. So killing a few hundred isn't going to make much of a dent. 

Olmert said that 'Hamas was completely surprised by Israel's determination and strength throughout the operation'. Yet Israel played it extremely safe, since Olmert didn't want huge Israeli losses before an election. Only 10 soldiers got killed, and 4 of those were from friendly fire. That's not just because they fought better, it's because they used very 'safe' tactics, i.e. not entering deep into Gaza and engaging Hamas directly. They stopped short of that, davkah because the Government didn't have the resolve to go that far. I think I'd have more respect for Olmert if he did have the cojones to try and destroy Hamas, at least that would have been a mission worth fighting for. As it stands, I wonder how much of this mission was really about Israeli politics. I guess only time will tell.

UPDATE: Even the jpost is skeptical. It will sure be tragic if this turns out exactly as I predicted. And no, I am not hoping for that.

Build Your Own Theology

This is interesting. Apparently many US Christian Fundies are rejecting Church imposed dogma and are instead inventing their own. Progress!

Two Mosholim

1. Your friend tells you that a super natural being exists. You check up on that, and it turns out nobody has ever seen this being, or has any good evidence that the being exists. The whole thing seems to be entirely fantasy. When you tell your friend this, he has a conniption fit, and tells you that nobody has ever proven that this being does not exist either. You think your friend is nuts. But then your friend tell you that not only does this being exist, but it wrote a book, and he shows you the book. You look at the book, and it looks like a typical collection of far fetched miracle tales, and out of date laws and moral values, very similar to many other ancient books. Certainly there's nothing about the book which would make you think a super natural being wrote it. In fact the book itself doesn't even claim that. Anyways, you take the book to your local university for fact checking and it turns out half the book is completely impossible and much of it is plain wrong. Also, linguistic scholars show you that the book was written in different dialects corresponding to different time periods, and they also point out numerous contradictions, omissions, and obvious signs of tampering. You tell this to your friend but he absolutely insists that a super natural being wrote almost every word of it, and anyone who says otherwise just doesn't know what they are talking about. You think your friend is really nuts. Then he tells you that you must adhere to all the laws in the book, including some very strange ones, and if you don't, the super natural being will punish you in some way. What do you do?

2. Your friend starts telling you he is having doubts about Hashem. He's not sure if Hashem is real. You ask everyone you know and they all look at you as if you're crazy to even suggest such a thing. So you go back and tell this to your friend, but he won't accept it. You think he's nuts. Then he starts telling you that there are contradictions in the Torah, and points out all sorts of kashyes on the chumash. So you go to your local yeshivah to do some fact checking, and for every question your friend asked there are multiple wonderful peshatim, including drashos from Chazal, Rishonim and Acharonim. Learning all of these gives you an incredible geshmack. So you go back to your friend to explain all of this to him, but he says that these drashos are all kvetches and Chazal has no credibility. Now you think he's really nuts. Then he tells you that he wants to eat chazah trayf and doesn't care about going to gehenom. What do you do?

Gaza Mesholim

Supporters of Gaza seem to like using Mesholim. For example: 

Your neighbour keep throwing missiles into your backyard. What do you do?

The problem is,  none of these Mesholim is particularly accurate, and in many cases actually highlite what's wrong with their position (a common feature of fundie mesholim by the way). So I thought I'd try my hand at making a moshol. I don't claim it's 100%. But it's a start.

Once upon a time, in a galaxy far, far away, your grandparents lived in a house. They were young and in love, and they loved the house. Now, how exactly they came to be in the house is a subject of some dispute. They claim that the landlord, who they didn't previously know, suddenly appeared one day and handed them title. They have the title document to prove it, but independant legal experts have examined the title and shown it to be a forgery. Plus, no one has ever seen this landlord or knows for sure of his existence. Anyways, your family was brought up on the story of your grandparents and their lovely house, and you never really paid that much attention to the finer details.

After the landlord gave them title, your grandparents, feeling rather emboldened, went in and pretty much kicked out the people living there. Or so they say. Neighborhood historians say this isn't what happened at all, rather it was a gradual organic displacement. Anyways, your grandparents ultimately got possession of the house, and lived there happily, giving birth to your parents. However the good times weren't to last, and eventually other people moved in and kicked out / displaced your grandparents, much like they had kicked out / displaced the people before them.

Your grandparents took off to another town, and made their life there. But they could never quite forget the good times they had in their early days, at their former home. The story after this gets long and depresssing, so I'll cut it short, but basically your grandparents had a lot of tzorres in this new town, ending in their eventual deaths. An awful story. At this point your parents were orphaned and homeless, and having heard all the childhood stories of their grandparents former hometown and home, they decided to return.

By this time though, a few other families were now living in the house, including some former neighbors, and all sorts of other people. The house was run down and dilapidated, but it was home to them. An almighyt fight ensued between your parents and the current residents. The local authorities, feeling sorry for your orphaned parents, actually let them back in the house. Many fights ensued, with the ultimate result that your parents gained the main floors, banishing the other residents half to a back room, and the other half to the basement.

Now, the basement is pretty lousy, no good facilities, a half bath, and the only door goes through the house, which your parents lock because they don't like the people in the basement. Of course the people locked in the basement are pissed as hell, because they want to live in the house. They don't want your parents (and now you) there at all. Also the people in the back room are pretty mad as well. Your parents claim they have a right to be there, but the people claim that the original title is a forgery anyway, plus your grandparents left a long time ago, and that's a ridiculous claim.

Anyways, recently things started heating up again. The people locked in the basement dug a small hole in the ground, got some rocks, and started throwing them into the living room. Your parents got mad as hell, and went down to the basement and beat the crap out of the people living their, their kids too. Now the authorities are getting involved. 

Your parents say 'Well they threw rocks at us', but the basement people say 'Well they stole our house, locked us in our basement, and now they beat the crap out of us!'. It's a very complex situation.

What do you do?

Is XGH really a Hamas Loving Israel Bashing Anti Semite?

I don't think so, some of my best friends are Jewish. Relatives too.

But a lot of people are wondering what the hell is going on. Why on earth is XGH arguing against the Gaza operation?

• Is he just a Hamas loving Nazi?
  
• Is it a parody of Lefties?
  
• Does this prove XGH is a moron?
  

Well, here's what's going on guys. Take it or leave it. (There's always some nut who refuses to believe me when I come clean on this stuff. That's fine, I don't have the time to debate idiots).

I first posted on Gaza on a whim. I didn't really have a definitive or well thought out position on the topic, kinda like most people on most topics, but I had just come back from Israel, saw all the dead children on the news, and my gut reaction was 'this is all just so wrong'. So I dashed out a quick post and didn't think much more about it. As you know, I rarely post about politics, and my main (sole?) interest is science & religion. I rarely like to dilute my blog with other stuff. It's a one track blog (Which has it's pros and cons, but that's the way it is. This in stark contrast to DB's blog for example).

Next thing that happens is a tremendous amount of comments, mostly extremely nasty, on this topic. Caught me by surprise. I mean of course I knew I would get flamed big time, but the extent of it was surprising, especially that I also found myself on the opposite side of most of the skeptics, which was very interesting. And then you had all the frummies barely able to contain themselves that the great XGH was wrong. Oh my gosh, me wrong? And there I thought I was infallible. Oh well. Maybe I can be content just being unflappable. 

Overall, the whole situation with the commenters was highly fascinating, and I figured that it could be useful to continue posting about Gaza for a while and see what happens. Let me stress that I am not playing games, and I do honestly think that the Gaza approach is wrong, but I decided to go with the flow as it where. I don't for a minute think that I have presented any good arguments yet, but I also don't think we have even barely scratched the surface of this very complex topic. We might not even be arguing about the same thing.

Some very interesting things that I am still digesting:

- How absolutely convinced people are (on both sides) -  it's amazing that there's no middle ground, or rather appreciation of the other side. To the Israel fundies, if you think Israel is wrong then you're EXACTLY like a Hamas Nazi. There's no possibility that you might have a valid position. Even if you're a nice frum Jew who might like to make Aliyah one day (if his wife agrees), and spends every vacation in Israel, it makes no difference. If you don't like the Gaza operation then you must be a pro-Hamas anti-Israel self-hating anti-semitic Jewish traitor. I mean, what other option is there?

- How different this is from the S&T debates. We debated there for 4 years. Here, after 4 days, everyone is going nuts. What gives? It takes time guys. Though I do realize that Israel needs popular support now to stave off a UN declaration.

Some other points:

- A few fundies dismissed my arguments on S&T. They said I was just an extemely skilled debater (and mocker), who won all his points on debating or mocking skills, rather than the content of my arguments. But I never agreed to that, I'm not really that great a debater, kinda average actually. I 'won' (or rather lost) the S&T debates because when the facts are on your side it's ridiculously easy to win. Here my debating was crap and so far have hardly convinced anyone of anything. That could be because my position is completely wrong, or it could be because I haven't spent enough time on the debates. Either way, I think it proves those fundies very wrong.

Also, with Gaza it's a very different argument than S&T. A lot of it is entirely subjective, and a lot of it depends on the future, which none of us can predict. Very little actual historical or scientific fact here.

There's a lot more to digest here. This is just a random smattering. But it's very interesting and funny to see how fundies are responding. Some people are loving it that I'm losing a debate, and think that calls into question the whole S&T thing. What's wrong with you people? I lost the whole S&T debate too, back in 2006, and that's exactly why I'm a skeptic.

Other people are calling me a fundie, because even though I lost the arguments (so far), I still believe I'm right, which is fundeism at its worst. Well, I have a few responses to that:

1. Its only been a few days! Sheesh.

2. This is a very subjective argument. We're not arguing over facts, but feelings and the future, both of which are highly subjective. Since I have a pessimistic outlook on the future, and since I really, really can't stomach the sight of little kids being blown up, I judge the operation to be wrong. Others may reasonably differ in either or both of those assessments for all sorts of reasons.

3. If someone admits they have no good arguments, but still has a 'gut' feeling they are right, that doesn't bug me so much. That's essentially the case with Chareidim, and I haven't really bashed them in years. My target is the Intellifundies, who insist they have strong rational arguments when it's clear that they don't. If someone says 'I believe in God, but I recognize it's just my subjective belief and nothing more', then I don't have any problem with that. In fact, that's exactly what I always say.

I don't care whether I win or lose an argument. I only care about what's true. I would think you should have figured that out by now. Sheesh.

Anyways, things have gotten very serious round these parts, and HH is requesting that I post something funny, say about hot sheitels. Problem is my wife just got a new hot channie sheitel and she looks great, so I would feel a little hypocritical bashing them right now. Of course wearing a hot channie for 'tznius' reasons is still absurd, but I'll have to leave it to someone else to chase that particular topic.

I think my next topic has to be epistemic justification. I gave Gil a hard time about it last week, but the discussion is far from over. The topics of justified belief, epistemic justification, absolutims vs relativism, and to some extent post modernism, are too important to ignore. And I do have some sympathy with relativist positions, after all fundies are absolutists. 

But truth is also extremely valuable, and any philosophy which doesn't share that value is suspect in my eyes. This is why I often talk about methodology, process, following the experts etc, rather than getting into detailed arguments about the 'facts' , e.g. on the DH. Reasonable people can disagree on facts, but as long as everyone is using a reason-based methodology, the truth will prevail.

My beef with the fundies (and primarily the Intellefundies, since the Chareidim are stam tinokot shenishbu) is that their methodology is inherently flawed, tainted with extreme bias, 'special pleading' and all sorts of other fallacies. But more on that later. Right now I have to finish reading my newest book: 'What is this thing called knowledge'.

As for Gaza, let's just hope (and pray) that no more people get killed. I hate it when people die, especially children.

Israel losing 4th Gen War conflict in Gaza

WASHINGTON, Jan. 14 (UPI) -- So far, Israel's assault on the Gaza Strip has produced no surprises. On the physical level of war, the Israel Defense Forces are triumphing. The Palestinians are suffering about 100 people dead for every dead Israeli. To a Second Generation War military, which is what Israel's formerly Third Generation War army has become, that is the main measure of victory.

On the moral level, the picture is reversed. Hamas, the Islamic Resistance Movement, is almost assured of victory. As Israeli military historian Martin van Creveld has observed, all it has to do to claim victory is survive, which it will. That claim will not be just propaganda: For Hamas to survive everything a modern state military can throw at it is a legitimate victory. In fact, it not only will survive but also will be strengthened by a worldwide flood of sympathy, which will translate in part into new recruits and more money.

In the end, if Israel wants to stop Hamas' rockets, it will be able to do so only by making a deal with Hamas. Since that was equally true before the war, the question of why it was fought will soon present itself. The real reason is a tad sordid: The current Israeli government is trying to split the "get tough" vote to prevent the Likud Party from winning the next election.

You can cry all you like about how it's all Hamas's fault, and how Israel tries harder than anyone else, and how Israel has every right to defend itself. And that might be technically correct. But when Israeli bombs kill 300 children in 2 weeks, to stop rockets which killed only 15 people in 5? years, nobody's going to care about that. And that's just reality.

Gaza Thought Experiment

Does it matter what nationality the human shields are? Not really, especially if they are children. So imagine this: Hamas terrorists are using Jewish children as human shields. Now what do you do? Whatever your answer is in that case, that is the moral course of action (assuming you are capable of moral thought).

Gaza Summary

So it seems my views on Gaza are pretty unpopular, at least on this blog. I was quite amazed at the level of vitriol directed at me for even daring to suggest that Israel was in the wrong, from both believers and skeptics alike. It's funny that the believers, who are convinced that the Torah is the only true path to true morality, are equally convinced that Israel's secular government is always in the right. It's likewise funny that cool headed skeptics, who can quite easily dismiss Torah and OJ, get all rabid at the thought that Israel could possibly do anything wrong.

I guess whether or not you agree that the Torah is the one true morality, the IDF certainly is.

Anyways, I'll certainly admit that my arguments have been weakly presented. DB has done a much better job at arguing for the Leftie cause. But I must point out that my views have nothing to do with skepticism. I was always a 'leftie', even 20 years ago when I learnt in a Chareidi Yeshivah in Jerusalem. I was there when Intifada 1 started, and I remember thinking how wrong headed it all was (the Israeli response), and how all that would happen was that these little 8 year old stone throwing kids would just grow up to be terrorists. And sure enough many of them did.

None of us can know how things will turn out. But the internal debate and criticism is alrady starting. The Israeli government haven't had a great track record. It's true that the West Bank is quiet, but the overall situation isn't great, and Lebanon was a bit of a disaster. I hope it turns out for the best, but I remain deeply pessimistic in that all that has really been achieved is a further degradation of Israel's image, and more hatred to come. When Hamas (anywhere in the world) kill a busload of Jewish children (chas vesholom), it will be hard to get any moral high ground, after the IDF just killed over 200 Gaza children.

Love the Children

What's it like to be an ordinary resident of Sderot compared to an ordinary resident of Gaza?

Sderot

• Chances of being killed by a Kassam: Very low.
  
• Early warning system for incoming attacks.
  
• Excellent system of bomb shelters
  
• Very good Magen David Adom
  
• Excellent Hospitals
  
• No shortage of medical supplies or doctors.
  
• Easy to move beyond Kassam range.
  

Gaza

• Chances of being killed by an Israeli bomb: Much higher
  
• No early warning system
  
• No bomb shelters
  
• Decimated ambulance system
  
• Decimated hospital system
  
• Few medical supplies or doctors
  
• Nowhere to go.
  

These are the facts, this is not subjective. 

Now you might argue,  given this drastic comparison, that Hamas are to blame for all this, and they certainly shouldn't have started a fight with such a vulnerable population. And of course that's true. The Hamas leadership are evil thugs who don't care about the ordinary Gazans. 

But we should. We should care about the Gazans MORE than Hamas cares. Golda Meir famously said that peace will come when Arabs love their children more than they hate us. But she might have been wrong.

I think peace will come when we love their children more than we hate them.

Let's Carpet Bomb Gaza

Yep, let's kill 'em all if we have to. Or so says our very own Nasrallah, former Chief Rabbi Mordechai Eliyahu:

All civilians living in Gaza are collectively guilty for Kassam attacks on Sderot, former Sephardi chief rabbi Mordechai Eliyahu has written in a letter to Prime Minister Ehud Olmert.

Former Sephardi chief Rabbi Mordechai Eliyahu.

Eliyahu ruled that there was absolutely no moral prohibition against the indiscriminate killing of civilians during a potential massive military offensive on Gaza aimed at stopping the rocket launchings.

The letter, published in Olam Katan [Small World], a weekly pamphlet to be distributed in synagogues nationwide this Friday, cited the biblical story of the Shechem massacre (Genesis 34) and Maimonides' commentary (Laws of Kings 9, 14) on the story as proof texts for his legal decision.

Funny, didn't Yaakov curse out Shimon and Levi for the Shechem Massacre?

The reality is that the civilians in Gaza are as much victims here as the Israelis are. They don't want to be human shields. Many of them probably want the Kassams to stop. But what can they do? If they protest, they will be killed as traitors. Having seen the vitriol that even rational skeptics showed here when I so much as dared suggest that the bombing is a bad idea, I can only imagine how any signs of 'traitorship' would be dealt with by Hamas.

I'm under no illusions at all that Hamas are a bunch of murderous thugs. No illusions at all. But that doesn't mean we should act likewise. It's not enough to try and prevent civilians being killed. Especially when they are being killed in their hundreds. It might be a 'pesik rayshah dloh nicha ley', but it's a 'pesik rayshah' (literally) nonetheless.

Yes, targeted bombs and warnings are good. But better yet is not to drop the bomb at all, especially when it's obvious there will be siginificant collateral damage. It's also just common sense. Killing hundreds of innocent people isn't going to bring any type of peace. It's just going to radicalize the enemy more. 

People complain that there is a double standard here. Well of course there is. Hamas are a terrorist group, while Israel is a democratic country attempting to be a 'light unto the nations'. I hold Israel to a much higher standard than Hamas. I hold Israel to a much higher standard than the US. I hold Israel to a much higher standard than any other country anywhere in the world. 

And so should you. 

The only useful question about God

A lot of people talk a lot of nonsense about God. Since there is zero data (and seriously, there is absolutely zero data about God), there's nothing that anyone can possibly know about God. Even though a lot of people feel He exists, that counts for absolutely nothing, since a lot of people feel Jesus exists, or Muhammed is the one true prophet. 

Some people will claim we have traditions. But which ancient traditions about anything have proven reliable? None at all, as far as I can tell.

So we're left with no data at all. Some people say we have some arguments, but really none of those arguments get you anywhere either. 

Where did the Universe come from? I have no idea, and neither do you. 

But surely the universe must have come from somewhere? Why? Have you done a survey of universes and found they mostly came from somewhere? 

But the universe is so fine tuned for life, the chances are astronomical! True, but that's no more wierder than saying God did it.

And even if you want to play the philosophy game and insist on a first cause, that still tells you absolutely nothing whatsoever about God.

All discussion about God is therwfore pure fantasy and projection. Actually, mostly the latter.

There's really only one useful question to be asked about God - Does believing in God make a society 'better' or not? Personally, I find myself to be more fatalistic, nihilistic and hedonistic when thinking God doesn't exist. But since I'm a former fundie, maybe that's what happens. However for someone brought up without God from birth, maybe that's not a problem. It's a very hard question to answer, and would require extended studies accounting for all sorts of variables, so I'm not even sure it could be answered.

I don't think Judaism without God can honestly be called Judaism though, so even though I have sympathy with the "God optional Judaism' crowd, cutting out all God talk seems too extreme. Instead, I would advocate reconstructing 'God' to mean MM&S or something similar. I don't think this is disingenous, for 2 reasons:

1. The Jewish conception of God has clearly significantly evolved, even during the Torah, and certainly down to the middle ages.

2. Nobody can comprehend what God is anyway, so I'm not sure it makes much difference.

So I'm OK with God talk, as long as the person talking realizes what he is saying. I still wish we could answer the one useful question though. Probably it makes no difference. After all, Hamas passionately believe in God, and all my commenters think they deserve to be bombed to hell., children and all.

Gaza Update

Number of Israelis killed by Hammas Rockets in 2 years: ~16?
Number of Gaza Children killed by Israeli bombs in 2 weeks: 225

I don't even need to say anything. The numbers speak for themselves. Is anyone out there still insisting this was a good idea?

Hirhurim and the DH

Here's my opinion on Hirhurim and the DH. No doubt Gil will disagree strongly, but you'll understand why.

I think Hirhurim and quite a few of his readers are actually quite fascinated by the DH, and do think it has a lot of merit. In fact, they would be happier if the DH was acceptable in OJ. They play this game of mentioning the DH, arguing against it, appearing very frum re Kugel and all, but the not so secret agenda is to get the DH out in the open. And not neccessarily to destroy it, but to advance the conversation either way.

I know some kiruv clowns / S&T reconciler types who are also toying with the DH. I even know one guy who explicitly told me that his long term plan is to get the DH to be acceptable within OJ (please don't try and guess who I'm talking about). Of course he would never say that in public, and no doubt is regretting having told me.

Will it happen? I'm not a prophet (though I might be a Navi) but I can't really picture it happening to be honest. Not because you couldn't have a vibrant Halachah with a Divinely Inspired DH Torah, I'm sure you could. But once you do that much damage to the Mesorah, the forces of other change (i.e. Halachic change) will be hard to stop.

Deleted passages from the Bible: Number 7

And Moses went out into the camp and saw a man picking up sticks on the Sabbath. And Moses cried out 'Sabbath offender, though shalt be given 40 lashes!'. And the man replied 'But I don't believe in God or Halachah'. And Moses cried out 'Blasphemer, thou shalt be put to death!' And the man replied, 'But my atheism is epistemically justified'. And Moses said 'Whoops, my bad, you've got a good point there', and promptly retracted all hilchos avodah zarah.

[Nimshal: Halachah does not recognize 'epistemic justification'. If you promote kefirah, you are chayav misah]

Epistemic Justifiability: Coming soon to a Kiruv Clown near you

Just when I thought we might be making some headway, Gil goes and mentions Alvin Plantinga. Plantinga is one of those respected philosophy types who also happens to be religious, in this case Protestant, and therefore not surprisingly has all sorts of philosophical theories justifying (his) belief in Christianity. Richard Swinburne is another one of these Philosophy clowns, who has a famous book 'proving' that God exists, with a best selling sequel 'proving' that Jesus Christ was His son. 

Although there's a lot of good stuff in philosophy, there's also a lot of nonsense, and anyone clever enough and well versed in philosophical terminology could probably make an argument for anything. I wish there was some Alan Sokal type guy who would write a book showing how belief in the Flying Spaghetti  Monster is epistemically justified. In fact, there probably is. 

So what's wrong with this line of reasoning? Simple. A belief may be justifiable, but that's a far cry from it being probably true. And if an argument for epistemic justifiability works for Christianity, Judaism and any other religion, then it doesn't say anything at all. It's only use is to make the intellefundies feel more intellectual and sophisticated. In a way, this type of philosophy is like religion, providing comfort to people who don't want to face the obvious truth.

But what about my respect for academia? Don't I have to respect Plantinga & Swinburne because they are academics? No, not at all. Although the Sciences (soft or hard) are exponentially more reliable than religion, that certainly doesn't apply to minority opinions. I hold of the DH because the global majority of all Biblical Scholars, no matter what religion, believe it to be true (based on reason and evidence).

However, when it comes to proofs for God, Jesus or Moses, and the only people claiming they have 'proofs' (or epistemic justifiability or whatever) are religious Christians and Jews, then its pretty obviously a case of bias. IF there was global academic concensus, across all types of religions and secular professors, that the proofs for God were decent, then I would agree. But there isn't, there is only a small minority of religiously biased individuals pushing this stuff, hence their views are irrelevant.

But have no fear, I'm sure it's only a short while until some S&T Kiruv Clown will put out a book based on Plantinga's or Swinburne's arguments. 

Did Hirhurim just admit that from a rational, objective standpoint, TMS is false?

It's always a crapshoot trying to decipher fundy comments, especially those written on Hirhurim. Inevitably I will be accused of deliberate misinterpretation, or deliberately trying to to make my opponents comments look as stupid as possible. My response to this is always the same - I simply take my opponents comments at face value, and take them to their logical conclusion. The fact that this often illuminates the inherent logical flaws or stupidity in them isn't my fault.

Anyways, here is what Gil wrote:

There is evidence for it [i.e. the DH] and many find it convincing. It is even true that if you come to the table with no preconceived notions and look only at the objective evidence, then you will arrive at the conclusion of multiple authorship.

But, I also said that the evidence is based on very limited information. If you have nothing else to go on and only draw conclusions from the objective evidence, then you are missing most of the picture. So if you have a preconceived notion, the evidence should not convince you.

Am I reading this right?! Sounds to me like Gil is saying as follows:

'True, the objective evidence supports the DH. But if you have a 'pre-conceived notion' i.e. that TMS is true (implication being that there is no objective evidence for TMS being true, it's just a 'notion' i.e. faith based), then the DH won't convince you.'

Of course what Gil is saying is factually correct, if you do indeed have a strong pre-conceived notion that TMS is true, then le'maaseh the DH probably won't convince you, because you will kvetch your way out of it in a hundred different ways, which is exactly what people do.

But what does Gil think he is saying? Is he admitting that objectively, DH looks more true than TMS?

I guess Gil probably thinks he is saying that the DH is not in itself 100% hard science, so while people without prior beliefs might be swayed by it, people with prior beliefs won't. As for the question of where one gets their prior beliefs from, and whether these are in any way justified, that's a different question I guess, but I assume Gil thinks that somehow his prior beliefs are justified, even without any objective evidence.

The reality is though, you really don't need the DH to see that the prior belief in TMS is false. Just read the text! There's simply no solid reason to assume God wrote it (if God even exists, which no one can prove either). It's a book. We know people write books. We also know that many, many religions claim to have Divine books, and that making a false Divine book claim is hardly unusual. We also know nothing about God, what God is, or whether God does in fact write books. So all things considered, having a 'prior notion' that God wrote a book is not really that defensible anyways, whether the book looks like it was written by one author, or a hundred.

I personally believe in God, but I'm still waiting for someone to give me a good reason (apart from utilitarian ones), for doing so. Because I haven't found any. There's simply no data whatsoever. None. Zilch. Nada. Not even the slightest iota of data. Seriously.

Which sect of Judaism is the least false?

(Click table to enlarge)

Honey, does this religion make me look false?

The outcome of many of the arguments with the recent Modern Orthodox Defenders of the Faith (MODOF) often seems to boil down to this:

XGH: OJ isn't true
MODOF: So what? OJ is good, and truth isn't the highest value.

In fact, a well known MODOF recently wrote to me saying (his exact words)

'I don't believe that upholding falsehoods is neccessarily wrong'

and another well known MODOF recently published an article where he described how for Chareidim, scientific truth is not neccessarily the highest value, and that's fine for them.

Now clearly, all these people would agree that truth is important, and that lying is wrong and so on. And of course the Torah itself proclaims that 'Midvar Sheker Tirchak', and Chazal say 'The seal of God is truth'. So how come when it comes to defending their religion all of a sudden lying, or upholding falsehoods, is ok?

The MODOF's answer is that sometimes being economical witht the truth, or telling a white lie, or even telling a bold-faced black lie is required, if it's for the greater good. The two classic examples are

1) Your wife asks you 'Honey, does this dress make me look fat?' (Or for people in Brooklyn 'Honey, does this sheitel make me look hot?')

and

2) Your Nazi torturer asks you 'I vill ask you only vonce. Vat is the secret code word for the resistance?'

Clearly in both cases, some lying might be appropriate. Why is this? Well, in example 1, it's only a little white lie, which makes your wife feel good, so why not? In example 2, the Nazi will clearly use the information for evil purposes, so lying is required.

So is the cheshbon here that even though a lie is still a lie, the lesser evil is outweighed by the greater good? Or is the cheshbon here that since there is a greater good, the lies isn't even a lie? Could be that in example 1, it's the former, while in example 2, it's the latter. After all, your wife doesn't really want you to lie to her in general, does she?

How would this apply to religion? Well, when a fundie asks 'Is my religion true?' and you respond affirmatively, you might argue that since the religion is making the fundie happy (or makes society better), by confirming its truth you are contributing to the greater good, as in the Wife or Nazi example. However, a counter argument to this is that the fundie wouldn't do the religion if it wasn't true, and furthermore would really like to know the truth and not be lied to, so in fact lying to him about this would not be appropriate. Plus religion in general can be quite evil, as can irrationality, so we should do our utmost to ensure that society behaves rationally and truthfully.

After all, we don't like it when Hamas claims that Isrealis are targeting children, do we? And likewise we don't like it when people claim the Holocaust didn't happen. The truth is pretty important. Almost foundational you might say.

Another approach might be to say that this isn't realy about the truth at all.

For example, when your wife asks 'Do I look fat', the reality is that she is looking for confirmation that you still find her attractive, or at least still love her, rather than an objective response about how fat she is. So in answering 'no', you aren't really making a statement about her weight, but rather about your relationship.

Similarly, when a fundie asks you 'Is my religion true?', they don't really want to know the truth, but are really looking for you to affirm their lifestyle. So when you answer 'Yes dear fundie, you had the good fortune to be born into the one true sect of the one true religion', you don't have to feel like you are lying to them.

However, religion is so fundamental to everything, that I still can't get past the fact that if it's ultimately all based on falsehoods (which it clearly is), then that just can't be a good thing, no matter how vacuous secular society is.

Anyways, I've barely scratched the surface of this topic, tzarich iyun godol meod.

Dawkins Witnesses

The Problem with S&T Reconciliation II

Last week I posted that my primary problem with the S&T reconciliators is that they never engage in any extended debate with skeptics, who are of course their primary opponents. Instead they spend any debating time with the Chareidim, who are of course nuts. This means that their opinions are intellectually unproven, and in the debates I have seen, the S&T chevrah fare very poorly indeed.

Solomon Schimmel wrote that he is actually having a debate with one Rabbi Shlomo Yaffe, who apparently is an up and coming OJ apologist and Chabadnick. No doubt Rabbi Yaffe can prove that not only did God write the Torah, but that the Lubvitcher Rebbe is Moshiach. Or maybe he can prove that the Lubavitcher Rebbe, as God, wrote the Torah? Either way, I'm sure it's going to be entertaining.

(Note: It's really incredibly simple to take down any OJ fundamentalist a notch or two. Just get them to acknowledge (as they must) that the entire Mesorah (i.e. Orthodox religion) is based on Chazal, then get them to explain why Chazal should have any credibility. Their answer will inevitably be circular - because Chazal said so).

This week I'd like to focus on my number two complaint against the S&T crowd, which is really an extension of number 1. The S&T crowd all deal with the easy stuff - for example the 6 days in Breishis. Of course there's a long tradition in Judaism of not taking Breishis literally, so there's not really a problem here at all (as long as you're not a revisionist Chareidi). However the S&Tniks grow noticeably quieter when it comes to the Mabul, since the traditional sources on that being allegorical are few and far between, and they get positively silent by the time you get to the fantastical stories in Shemos.

Also, and more importantly, they typically don't address the hard issues at all - for example that the entire world's biblical scholars have all come to the same conclusion (based on reason and evidence), namely that the Bible was written by multiple authors over many generations. I think I saw recently that one S&T reconciliator called this a 'formidable challenge', though of course not one that he himself has addressed in any convincing way.

By the way, you really don't have to be a Bible expert to see this for yourself, just read the text! The difference between, say the stories in Breishis, and how they portray God, and later on, are quite noticeable. Same deal with how different Devarim is, not just linguistically, but in the retelling of the stories in Shemos. Of course you can always find (or invent) some nice drush on any of this.

Other difficult issues that the S&T crowd don't address are the ample scholarship that shows how the cult of Yahweh evolved, the archeological record which shows there was no mass conquering of Israel, and other aspects of ancient religion and ANE history which contradict the Rabbinic account. Plus you have the fact that never mind the that Chazal obviously didn't know modern science, they didn't know ancient history, not even their own! So the question becomes what credibility do they have?

Of course you also have the general problem that no ancient religions or belief systems have any credibility in general, and there's not much good reason to think any differently in this case. There is no evidence of God, miracles, or anything of the supernatural, and plenty of evidence of human hands in all religions. Add to that the ample evidence of extreme bias evident inall fundamentalists (e.g. Gedolim insisting the world must be 6000 years old), and it's really not a pretty picture at all.

Which is presumably why the vast majority of the world's educated elite don't believe a word of it, save for a few outposts of fundamentalists who have by chance found themselves in wider society, with their religious indoctrination still intact.

In sum, when the S&T reconcilers actually deal with the hard questions (and of course engage with the skeptics), I'll have some intellectual respect for their opinions.

Song for my brother

Some anonymous commenter, who never adds any value to this blog whatsoever but only drops in to try and criticize me personally, questioned my motives on my Gaza post, as to whether my motivation was to bash people (I guess in this case the Israeli goverment?), or whether I was genuinely concerned for the lives of Israelis and Palestinians. It's a sad state of affairs when people can't imagine that someone could be genuinely upset over loss of life, but there you go. Here is a song dedicated to all the people who have died, are dying, and will die in this conflict.