Natural Reflections: Human Cognition at the Nexus of Science and Religion

I don't know anything about the author but the book sounds interesting.

Also see here and here.

ej?

Disaster Theodicy

As predicted, the usual post-disaster theodicy debates have started. But I think people may be jumping to conclusions. When a fundie says "We should learn from disaster X to do teshuvah for sin Y", or even if they say "Disaster X happened because of sin Y", for example: "Haiti happened because Jews spoke Loshon Horoh", I'm not so sure that what they really mean is that God killed 100,000 goyim JUST to warn yidden about loshon horoh.

I think it's more likely that they mean we should learn a lesson from this disaster as that's the Jewish way, or even maybe that the reason why such a disaster happened at this particular time and in this way is to teach such and such a lesson, but I don't think that they really mean to say that the ONLY reason all these innocent people died is because of loshon horoh or some other sin committed by Yidden. I find it hard to believe that anyone normal, even a fundie, would take such a stance. OK, possibly a fu**ing idiot like Avi Shafran might actually mean to say that, but surely not one of the Gedolim (even one of the clueless ones)?

Am I being naive? Maybe. So I challenge anyone to find me a quote from a TRUE Odom Godol which unequivocally states that the ONLY reason (or the main reason) why 100,000 (or similar large number) of Goyim died was just to teach Yidden a lesson and for no other good reason.

Tropper Tapes Could Have Been Doctored

Harry Maryless (and others) are commenting on the (rather strange) interview with Rabbi Dovid Ribiat of Monsey that apeared on VIN and the 5 Towns Jewish News, where Tropper was compared to Slifkin (lehavdil elef havdolos - one is a possible kofer and the other is a confirmed menuval, and we all know that from a Chareidi POV a potential kofer is a million times worse). Ribiat claims that there isn't 100% evidence yet about Tropper, since the tapes could be false - for example some people claimed that Guma created them by copying and pasting snippets from various entierly innocent conversations. Well, I listened to Tropper's phone sex tape, and it's pretty damning. But you never know, so I got thinking about it and this is what could have happened. (Note some things will have to be left to your imagination).

Innocent Conversation:
Orand: When can we next meet to discuss my geirus?
Tropper: I want to put you on my schedule for next week, is that OK?
Orand: That's fine, thank you Rabbi Tropper.
Tropper: Did you speak to Rabbi Dickstein?
Orand: Yes, I had an excellent conversation with him.
Tropper: Very good. It is in your interest to speak to as many Talmeidi Chachomim as possible so that you are well prepared for your giyur test.
Orand: Yes, he was very helpful in answering all my shailos.
Tropper: OK good. I will out of the country till next week, I'll speak to you then.
Orand. Thank you Rabbi Tropper.
Tropper: Be well.

See? Not so hard to do.

Yet another moronic post from Avi Shafran

Just when you thought Avi Shafran couldn't get possibly get any stupider or less self aware, he goes and outdoes himself. In his latest moronic post, Shafran tells us that a Jewish response to tragedies such as Haiti is to be introspective and consider our sins. OK fair enough. So what are the sins that Shafran thinks we should be introspective about? Chareidi scandals? Child molesting? Tax evasion? Tropper?

No!

The sins that are to blame are those of the bloggers and secular media who have been reporting on these scandals! These are the sins we need to be introspective of. These are the sins that God is trying to warn us about, by killing 100,000 Haitians.

If I ever met Shafran I would truly want to punch him on the nose for being such a f***** idiot. Alternatively, maybe I should hug him for showing us once and for all how truly awful he and his fellow compatriots are.

What does DovBear really believe?

DB writes that he believes that "Heaven and earth once intersected at Sinai, at an event we call matan torah". But what does this mean? Is it the kind of fluffy bs that I like to write occasionally, for example "The Torah is Divinely Inspired" i.e. inexact enough to not actually mean anything at all? Or does DB actually believe that 3500 years ago a man named Moshe actually received some kind of Divine transmission, and wrote it down, word for word?

Inquiring minds want to know. And no, this isn't a "tzitzis check", it's a "are you a big faker" check.

Deah VDibur / Mordechai Plaut and the Gedolim

Isn't it funny how Deah vDibur, one of the biggest "pro Gedolim" sites on the net, is now ignoring a direct order from the Gedolim?

The people from the Chareidi "Etrog" site had to shut down (even though their site was very respectable), as they write:

"This morning, we were personally informed that all chareidi internet activity must immediately cease."

See that? "ALL" Chareidi internet activity must cease. Even though Etrog was respectable, they had to shut down? Why because the Gedolim want to BAN the internet, no exceptions.

However Mordecahi Plaut thinks he knows better than the Gedolim. He's kvetching heterim for himself, as he writes:

"The focus of the campaign of the Gedolim against chareidi Internet sites is directed at the forums and blogs that are conducted on an anonymous basis for fun and profit."

Says who? I didn't see that in anything the Gedolim have said. On the contrary, the Gedolim banned the internet, period. NO EXCEPTIONS. He goes on to give this kvetch:

"Dei’ah Vedibur is the opposite of these. I am fully identified. The site is run on with a low-key style with the aim of informing about the issues that affect the chareidi community. The site has no advertising and no one benefits in any material way if there are more or fewer viewers."

Typical hypocrisy from Deah VDibur / Mordechai Plaut. When it suits them, they'll bash any Jew who isn't in line with the Gedolim. But when it doesn't suit them, then they'll ignore the Gedolim too.

In reality, this is how the whole "Gedolim" thing works. It's all about power and control. The Gedolim are basically clueless about society. Those who control access to the Gedolim have the power. They manipulate the Gedolim to their own ends. I actually feel sorry for most of the Gedolim, they're mostly old men who get bothered all day long by "askanim" and other political power players. It's no co-incidence that the people who promote the concept of the "Gedolim" are the power players, with the clueless rank and file falling dutifully in step.

It's also a shame that certain elements of "Modern Orthodoxy" are basically playing the same game, though since the only MO Godol who ever lived has been dead for a while, their game is "interpreting" his every written (or spoken) word, rather than manipulating his kol korehs.

The whole concept of a "Godol" is natural though - humans have a need for inspiring role models, it's actually quite incredible how people can be swayed to do the most amazing / horrendous things due to charismatic leaders. There is a famous quote that "only religion can make good people do bad things", but I think that's somewhat inaccurate. The reality is that "only charismatic leaders can make good people do bad things.". Just look at Hitler or Stalin.

There is another famous quote that "more evil acts have been done by people acting obediently (i.e. following orders / dictates of society) than by people acting disobediently / rebelliously. All it takes is one charismatic (and evil) leader to do tremendous harm. But an evil leader is powerless without followers.

Luckily, the Gedolim aren't evil, just clueless. And they are generally manipulated to focus on the wrong things. You could argue that they should at least realize that this is what is going on, but I'm not so sure, it depends on how clueless they are. However I do agree that the second tier of Gedolim (i.e. the Gedolim Wannabee's) do bear some measure of blame.

Haiti and the Chareidim

I've been following the Haiti situation (like everyone else) for all the normal reasons, plus someone I know is actually missing there. One aspect of this awful tragedy though has surprised me - when it happened, some skeptic friends of mine were asking how long until some Chareidi Rav blames it on Loshon Horo or something equally ridiculous. Yet not only has that not happened, I think I detect a sea change in Chareidi attitudes - YWN proudly reporting on Zaka's mission there and similar articles in the Chareidi press.

Have the Chareidim finally realized that they are citizens of the world, and all humanity is created (kaveyochol) btzelem elokim?

Yeshiva World News (YWN) Opposes All the Gedolim

As (ironically) reported by YWN, all the major Gedolim have come out unequivocally against the Internet, stating that anyone using the Internet is cutting themselves off from Klal Yisroel.

As YWN is continuing to use the Internet, once can only assume that they are directly ignoring the Gedolim in the most public possible way. Such a direct bizayon of the Gedolim has not been seen on the internet since the early days of the Science and Torah ban, and such behavior was soon discontinued and Teshuvah was performed by those involved.

YWN's continued existence is a slap in the face to the Gedolim, and makes it appear that the Gedolim are to be ignored or even chas vesholom ridiculed, by the very people who claim to be their followers. Yet another major bizayon to Chareidi Judaism.

More Scandalous Tropper Behavior: Phone Sex

Wow. Looks like the Tropper audio we had wasn't even the good stuff. Tablet Magazine has audio of Tropper having phone sex. That guy has cojones. Meanwhile some more details about the whole story have surfaced on various sites, but there's a lot more to this story. We'll probably never know the full extent of what went on, nor do we have to. We know enough already.

Somebody commented that its scandalous that the Gedolim haven't made any kind of public announcement about this. But I think they're embarrassed at having been conned, and also don't want to believe it. Easier to say the whole thing was a fabrication by Gumar, who was recently committed for acting very strangely.

As for Tropper being a Rosh Yeshivah, someone commented that the yeshivah never had more than 10 bochrim anyways, and they were all weirdo BTs. Makes sense. I've seen some personal emails from Tropper and he seems like a strange dude.

OJ institutions must have responsible boards, otherwise don't give them any money

There's a reason why corporations, shuls, schools and most major institutions religious, secular or commercial have boards or similar bodies - it's to provide some level of oversight, and ensure that an individual president or CEO with nefarious ambitions or schemes is kept in check. Of course fraud is possible even with a board, and some boards are ineffective or out of touch with what's really going on. But not having a board should not be an option for any institution.

The board should meet regularly, should have full transparency into what is going on, and be composed of a suitable and diverse group of experienced people. This is not optional. And, in the event that something scandalous happens, the board bears some measure of responsibility (unless it can be shown that they were deliberately fooled by the institution).

However, it seems to me that none of this was the case at EJF, Horizons, Kol Yaakov and probably many other Kiruv and Orthodox institutions too.

The EJF web site does mention an "International Rabbinic Board" composed of the following individuals:

• Harav Doniel Neustadt: Chairman of The Vaad of Detroit
• Harav Yoel Adelman: Rav, Young Israel of Huntington
• Harav Nachum Eisenstein: Chairman , Vaad Linyonei Giyur Haolomi - Jerusalem
• Harav Aharon Felder: Rosh Bais Din, Philadelphia
• Harav Yaakov Kapelner: Bais Din Daas Mishpat, Monsey
• Harav Mendel Senderovic: Rosh Bais Din, Milwaukee
• Harav Dovid Shochet: Senior Member of Toronto Bais Din
• Harav David Yosef: Rosh Yeshiva, Yechave Daat, Jerusalem

But what kind of board is this? Do they meet regularly? Do they know what was really going on? If so, they are somewhat culpable too. Do any of my readers know any of these people? I would like to know what their involvement was/is with EJF.

In general, I would advise NOT giving any tzedakah (or any other assistance) to any institution that doesn't have a board. There is simply too many opportunities for fraud when major financial decisions are handled by a few individuals in relative secrecy. And, knowing the way many of these operations operate, it is vital that people are on the lookout for "fake" boards (presumably like the above), who don't meet, are not involved, and generally don't know what's going on (but presumably get "donations").

I would like to ask Rabbi Adelman of the Young Israel of Huntington the following questions:

• What was your involvement with EJF?
• What kind of board was this?
• Did you, or your shul receive ANY money from Tom Kaplan (via EJF or otherwise) ?

EJF was designed to *lower* standards of geirus!

There's a few things that don't add up here.

1. Why would Tom Kaplan, a secular Jew, be interested in raising standards of conversion to extreme levels? Especially if the whole purpose of EJF was to help ease conversions of non Jewish spouses.

2. The story of the woman's geirus which was revoked because she wore pants. How come EJF never countered this story? How is this story possible, since EJF themselves doesn't do the actual geirus? Why did we never hear from the actual person involved? And how come Tom Kaplan didn't object?

3. How come there have been persistent claims from people in the field (most recently from Abba Dunner) that the EJF standards were actually lower?

Here what I think was really going on.

Tom Kaplan's mission was to make it EASIER for non Jewish spouses to convert. There is no question about this. He funded Tropper for EXACTLY this mission. Tropper conned the Gedolim into joining precisely to make it appear that he was trying to raise standards (and no doubt for yichus etc). The crazy story about the woman in jeans was a fake story designed to boost EJF's image as being extra strict. EJF never countered the story because it served their purpose, maybe EJF even planted that story. Kaplan never objected for the same reasons.

The other alternative was that EJF was conning Kaplan, pretending to lower standards whereas in reality they were raising them. But this is actually the less likely scenario, for the reasons posted above. It's easier (and safer) to con a bunch of Gedolim than to con your primary (jn fact only) financial sponsor.

Now it all makes sense. The whole point of EJF was to lower standards, and all the Gedolim stuff was purely about image. The Gedolim participated for all the reasons that Eli Neuberger and Abba Dunner wrote about.

[Incidentally, this whole incident proves once and for all that the Gedolim not only don't have any special Daas Torah, but they don't even have normal Daas Hedyot (or Daas Baal Habatim). They were unable to see through the deception.]

Holy Moly! R Abba Dunner dishes the dirt on EJF and Tropper

[XGH: I find it hard to believe that Dunner researched and wrote all this.]

By Rabbi Abba Dunner

It is long established pattern of the hired cheer-leaders of the EJF to attempt to blacken the name of anyone who criticizes their activities in any way - the pot of gold that the EJF has found is worth $25 million and counting and who wants to lose out on that?

But it is clear who the real ganef is in this sad story - it is anyone who associates themselves with this organization whose sole function is to leech as much money as possible out of Mr. Kaplan.

[XGH: Isn’t that the standard operating procedure of ALL Kiruv style organizations – try and get as much as possible out of rich, guilty secular Jews?]

The feeble attempts to publish fact sheets in the Jewish media demonstrates what and who they are - no serious or well meaning organization finds it necessary to print fact sheets stating that they are not low-lives, not ganovim, etc etc [XGH:Not pimps?]. This is usually a given in any moisad - and if they have to publish something of this nature it can only be that they are and always have been goineiv daas habri'os on a giant scale. [XGH: lame argument]

Some real facts:
EJF is an organization entirely funded by a (well meaning) secular Jew whose interests are the preservation of wild cats which are endangered by encroaching civilization and the preservation of Jewry which is endangered by intermarriage.

[XGH: LOL, but the wild cats comment was unneccssary]

His solution for the latter is to encourage the non Jewish partner to convert - the same approach taken by the reform and more recently, the conservatives. The EJF has a rolodex containing botei din across the USA to which it refers potential converts which it claims to have selected and vetted. Many of those botei din have expressed surprise that potential geirim were being referred to them - small and relatively inexperienced, instead of being sent to the big established botei din in the major centers of yiddishkeit. The reason is simply that the EJF refers cases which it claims are ready for giur to a small beis din that will accept their recommendation when a larger more established beis din would not consider the case in any way suitable.

[XGH: Interesting allegation. Is this true? i.e. That EJF actually had lower standards???]

Additionally the ejf besmirches the name of botei din with track records measured in decades and whose credentials are impeccable but who have the temerity to question their judgment and qualifications).

Rabbonim from small towns across the USA were continually surprised over the last few years that intermarried couples who they reckoned were unready for giur - even though they might qualify with a year or two of work - were leaving town and returning a month or two later having been converted through an ejf recommendation and officially having been mentored successfully by the ejf.

[XGH: This kinda contradicts the claim above. Above he said that the geirim were being redirected from large botei din to smaller ones, since the large well established ones wouldn’t have done the geirus, and here he is saying they werebeing redirected away from the smaller ones.Maybe he just meant to say ‘towns across the USA”]

In many of these instances the levels of observance were insufficient to start with and diminished subsequently with many ending up only nominally practicing Jews.

To burnish their credentials as the only chareidi purveyors of geirus, the game plan was to present themselves as the most chareidi organization out there by buying their way into the chotzer of the Gedolim by giving kickbacks to the various individuals who attempt to surround the Gedolim. By steady drip feeding of a few thousand here and there to help with a chasuna or pay off some choivos or support a pet project, Tropper managed to buy his way in and then parade his ability to get photo ops as if that made him a ne'emon of the Gedolim.

The story that he was telling was that all botei din and mekarvim in the USA were not to be trusted with the future of klal yisroel and only someone with his dikduk bemitzvos particularly in the areas of kiruv was in the position to handle it properly. This from a man whose personal habits until this time had been a matter of concern to all who knew the facts and whose yeshiva had not managed more than a minyan of balei tshuva at any given time.

In the kiruv world he was not regarded as even a side-show, particularly because of his habit of telling anyone who would listen that only he knew about kiruv and that everyone else attempting it is a charlatan.

The EJF then went about organizing conventions of Rabbonim and Roshei yeshivos in the USA again trumpeting the terrible standards of giyur and their qualifications to solve the problem. Many attendees enjoyed being flown to Washington or the Davids Citadel or Kibbutz Lavi all expenses paid but were surprised to be invited seeing as they were largely not involved in giur. Very few of the participants were top ranking poskim with expertise in the subject and while they were often high level talmidei chachomim and Roshei Yeshivos, they would not necessarily be consulted on this topic.

However, given that the names of the worlds preeminent Gedolim were being thrown around as if they had personally checked and verified the activites of the EJF and because so many other prominent Roshei Yeshivos were present, most relied on it all being real.

Meanwhile in the field the real agenda was Mr Kaplan's which is to get the largest number possible to become Jewish and therefore botei din were encouraged to convert people shipped half way across the country and cleared by the EJF. To find the customers, the EJF offered money to local rabbonim and mekarvim to find them intermarried couples to attend their seminars - not couples where the jewish half was moving towards yiddishkeit: any intermarried couples would do.

They were also hiring field workers to go and find intermarried couples - a sort of giur bounty hunt - and were offering organizations money, which to their credit many refused, to allocate staff to this very dubious purpose which it is unlikely they were telling the gedolim!

Additionally, they were trying to break into the European market where stringent standards were already in place through the efforts of the CER over the previous ten years. If they could buy their way in there, they would be able to add the number of geirim being processed around Europe to their bottom line and justify the millions that they were milking from Mr Kaplan.

The problem was that Tropper's personality is so obnoxious, that when he showed up to address a European Rabbinic convention, he yelled at the assembled (very bemused) rabonim that they were all frauds and charlatans and that only he knew the real path to kiruv. He had a hissy fit and stormed out of the room when one of the (by now very amused) rabbonim had the cheek to ask him a question.

[XGH: No way did Abba Dunner just write "hissy fit". Who is writing this?????]

To keep this happening while diverting attention away from the real activities and towards the chareidi image being projected, Lubicom PR agency headed by Mr Menachem lubinsky was running a big-time campaign to keep the operation going.

The seminars and the venues, the speakers and the message were all coordinated by Lubicom - who apparently billed around $500,000 last year for their efforts. When has a serious klal organization had its image and message manufactured by a PR company?

Yiddishkeit isn’t a detergent or automobile which needs hard sell and message management and when something claiming to be yiddishkeit does, it should be immediately a cause for suspicion. It must be noted however that they do a great job as they have successfully managed to position EJF as a mainstream and serious organization and create an image in the mind of unsuspecting Gedolim and public.

They have also done a wonderful job post-Tropper-fiasco of fighting a rearguard action with limited weaponry and under very adverse conditions. They produced some gloriously meaningless press releases designed to say nothing at all while the damage assessment was underway. They were all over the blogs with whole-hearted defenses of the defenseless which could not be attributed to them.

The Rabbi Wachtfogel press release was clearly not cleared by him and his subsequent disavowal of it shows that they are happy to cheerfully publish letters in other peoples names without consent. They spread the usual quarter-truths and innuendos mixed in with a good dosage of plain old-fashioned sheker - the prime example of which is the mealy-mouthed puff-piece mentioned above that most frum news outlets were paid kesef molei to run. (some were honest enough and brave enough not to run it and were subjected to a barrage of abuse by
Lubicom/EJF)

Rabbi Blum who apparently heads the organization after the Tropper scandal and Rabbi Wachtfogel refusal is a nice young man who until now was an office manager on a regular secretary/PA salary. He has suddenly been promoted to the top of the organization; apparently Troppers replacement, on the basis of this paltry experience. He is the man who is now going to be the recognized scourge of bad geirus and mouthpiece of the gedolim. He is however, nothing more than a straw man for Lubinsky, etc who wish to steer clear of the limelight. (Interestingly enough, in the weeks preceding the eruption of the scandal, Lubinsky and Yisrael Freedman were attempting to ease Tropper out of the driver's seat into a more nominal role.

Did they know something was wrong? Did they just feel that Tropper was losing credibility? In any event, the publication of the offending material certain provided them with a fast-track to remove him from the organization entirely. Another interesting twist is that suddenly EJF purports to be a player in the Kiruv field - is this a way of buying themselves a new place at the table now that giur seems to be turning toxic in the chareidi world? Do they think that perhaps they can buy off some kiruv professionals and become man de'omrim in the field of outreach which is much more acceptable to the frum world?)

Tropper is a fraud.

The organization he created is in his image and is therefore a fraud too. The creators of that image are fraudsters and hucksters who are trying desperately to keep the line to Mr Kaplan's millions open. The chareidi world feels diminished and tainted and wishes they would go away and the chilul Hashem would stop.

[XGH: Very interesting, probably all or mostly true, but I don't believe Abba Dunner wrote this.]

Letter from Hirhurim to the Post Orthodox

[Note: I didn't make any of this up, it's all in the comments on Hirhurim]

Dear Post Orthodoxer

A number of you seem to be unhappy with my attempt to write you out of Orthodoxy. But I have done no such thing!

Firstly, *I* have not written you out, on the contrary, *you* have written yourselves out, due to wanting broader roles for women, and not fully accepting the ikkarim. I of course would never write someone out of Orthodoxy, but I won't object to you, yourselves, writing yourselves out, if you so should chose. I am simply reporting the facts. Do you see the difference? The difference is poshut - in the former case, I am writing you out, but in the latter case, you are writing yourselves out. Two completely different things.

Secondly, "post" does not equal "non"! Even though everyone seems to read it as "non", I can prove it doesn't, because of some Christian Theologian who used it to not mean non (see for example Post Evangelical). And as you all know, I get most of my hashkafah from Christian Theologians (see for example my many posts on Epistemic Justification and Richard Swinburne).

And finally, I myself hold of some of these "Post Orthodox" beliefs, so really, how bad can my list be? I mean, if I, who look Chareidi, act Chareidi, send my kids to Chareidi schools, daven in a Chareidi shul and live in a Chareidi neighborhood, can admit to having some of these beliefs how can there be anything wrong with them? (Note to potential mechutonim: don't worry - I especially put in a couple of dummy completely kefirah-free beliefs in there just for this purpose)

So in summary (a) You wrote yourselves out and (b) "Post' doesn't mean "non" anyway, so in fact you're in and (c) I hold of some of these beliefs anyway.

So nothing at all to be upset about.

Kind regards,

Hirhurim.

ebay: I Will Wear Tznius Clothes for a Week! Bidding starts at $300

http://cgi.ebay.com/I-Will-Wear-Tznius-Clothes-for-a-Week_W0QQitemZ270511420554QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item3efbbcb48a

Hmm, I wonder what people will pay me to believe in the ikkarim for a week? I mean, that's much more important than tznius, no?

I'm not anti religion, just anti stupidity, ignorance and unacknowledged bias

One of my commenters recently wrote that I had finally turned into "just another anti-religion skeptic blog". But that's not true at all! I love religion, I love learning, Torah, Mitzvos, Shabbos, Community, Zemiros, my Rabbis, Eretz Yisroel, Latkes and more.

What I am "anti" is stupidity, willful ignorance, unacknowledged bias, illogical arguments, bias, racism, "holier than thou" attitudes, corrupt morality, disingenuousness, obscurantism, fantasy masquerading as reality and more.

In as much as those two things overlap, then I'm anti. Please refer to the diagram if you have trouble understanding this concept.

It's official: Israeli chareidim are nuts, chareidim in general rapidly going downhill

This is just awesome. I think it pretty much proves what the skeptics have been saying all along - once you let go of rational, evidence based analysis, then anything goes. The Modern Orthodox Morons may laugh at their Chareidi cousins, but they're not far off.

"A day after hours of effort by Rav Dovid Batzri, the noted mekubal, to chase a dybbuk from a Brazilian man, the Eidah Hachareidis off Yerushalayim placed the dybbuk in nidui, excommunication, and forbade it from causing any harm to Rav Batzri.

Following Wednesday night’s efforts to exorcise the dybbuk in the ezras noshim of Yeshiva Hashalom in Yerushalayim, Rav Batzri feared that the dybbuk may try to cause him harm. Rav Batzri turned to the bais din of the Eidah Hachareidis. Rav Moshe Shternbuch, Rosh Av Bais Din of the Eidah, released a p’sak from the bais din placing the dybbuk in a state of excommunication and formally forbidding it from causing any harm to Rav Batzri.

All over Eretz Yisroel, conversation revolves around this mysterious dybbuk which refuses to leave the body of the Brazilian avreich after two attempts to banish it, one via video conferencing and one, Wednesday night, in person, in the presence of thousands.

The dybbuk remains entrenched in the body of the Brazilian avreich and another attempt to chase it away is expected next week."

You are very probably a Modern Orthodox Moron if...

1. You think that the Rambam's thirteen fundamental principles are binding in any real way
2. You believe that there are no post-Mosaic additions to the Pentateuch and ignore 200 hundred years of quality scholarship
3. You think that the Amoraim never distorted the views of Tannaim, and that the chain of mesorah is absolutely unbroken
4. You believe that the conclusions of the Gemara are halakhically binding because Chazal said so
5. You disapprove of increasing women's roles in synagogue ritual even though there are no halachic issues involved in doing so
6. You don't support the ordination of women, or any changes at all in their status, because you are scared of losing your religious power
7. You think that Rabbis know Jewish history better than academics, or even the Bible
8. You want single universal standards for conversions and don't think that local rabbis know what's best for their conregants
9. You believe minhagei shtus have value and should never be changed no matter what
10. You believe that you're a member of the one true religion and that all other religions are a waste of time
11. You are homophobic and think gay people are immoral
12. You believe that its ok to discriminate against women
13. You think that "Gedolim" are somehow better than shul rabbis

Did I leave anything out?

Amazing new archeology find proves that fundies like archeology when (they think) it helps their case

Typical fundie disingenuousness. All we hear from them is how subjective archeology is and how it doesn't show anything etc etc etc. Archeologists are all reshoim out to destroy the holy Torah. Yet as soon as something helps their cause (in reality this doesn't, but it won't stop various web sites from claiming it does) they're all over it.

Note fundies: Sorry to burst your bubble, but there is still ZERO evidence (or any good arguments) that God wrote the Torah (or even exists).

ZERO.

And as for those "rational" types who say "It's reasonable to believe in God", well, it's just as "reasonable" to not believe in God, so that doesn't really help very much, does it?

And as for those "rational" types who think they're being rational when they say "Chazal didn't know science", in fact they're being quite irrational. Because for the exact same reasons that Chazal didn't know science, they didn't know history either. We have MUCH better knowledge today than Chazal ever did about ancient Jewish history, scribal culture, authorship of the Torah etc etc etc. Chazal didn't have any evidence or research on any of this. All they had was traditions. And we all know how reliable traditions are (hint: not reliable in the slightest).

The Morality Curve (as I see it)

Do mikva ladies spy on people?

Calm down, I don't mean peeping tom type of spying. Nor do I mean checking that they were tovel lechumrah. What I mean is - my wife told me that her friend told her (clearly an ultra-reliable chain of information here) that the local mikveh lady keeps track of who is coming to the mikveh and who isn't. Could this be possible? I'm highly skeptical. I mean, what for? Will they call someone and say 'Hey, we haven't seen you in a while?' Are they using it for shidduch checking? To ferret out the heretics? (Doesn't work for OPs). And anyway, how could they know that someone hasn't been, maybe they were out of town and went to another mikveh? Unless of course all the mikves have a giant consolidated tracking system (joke). But even then, you could have gone abroad, or dipped in the river. Or maybe due to various issues never needed to go very much. This whole thing sounds completely ridiculous. Forget I even posted it. Thanks.

Shanon Orand Converts in Israel! Tropper still a Rosh Yeshivah!

Wow. Shannon Orand gets a bona fide Israeli conversion. And she didn't even need to do any tricks with that Satmar guy or Rebbetzin Tropper!

She also reveals an extremely important detail: Tropper was paying her legal fees for a custody fight with her ex husband.

Meanwhile, Daas Torah reports that Tropper is in process of being rehabilitated. Unbelievable.

The Super Secret Esoteric Kabalistic Tikun For Removing a Dybuk

Apparently you shout:"Get Out Dybuk". Who woulda thought?

Unfortunately it didn't work. Perhaps they should have said "Please?". I love this line:

"At one point, the dibuk appeared willing to leave the host, via an eye, but Rav Batzri shouted he does not have permission to harm the young man, ordering him to leave via the small toe of his left foot only, with causing any harm to the young man."

In other news, YWN has changed from calling it a "foreign deity" to a "foreign entity". I guess they aren't polytheists after all. Anyways, if this doesn't prove that fundies are completely nuts I don't know what will.

Tom Kaplan (EJF) gave $5m to Tropper and $3m to Feinstein

Why LWMO is lechatchiloh, and RWMO/Chareidim are immoral

As we all know, you can't prove that your fundie religion is true. In fact, mostly the evidence points the other way. Just because Chazal/Muhammad or whomever said X is wrong, doesn't make it neccessarily so. Now of course morality is subjective, but still, if everyone agrees that something is wrong (or right) then at the very least such an opinion must be seriously evaluated and considered.

RWMO and Chareidim reject all this and insist that whatever halachah permits (or forbids) is morally ok. However, this may not be the case at all. RWMO's criticize LWMOs for being too open to secular morality and norms, however this is the only moral way to behave. All options must be considered and analyzed. By refusing to even consider that their own deeply held convictions may be wrong, RWMOs (and of course Chareidim) are in fact acting immorally.

This is poshut.

New Name for (LW) Modern Orthodoxy

I was chatting with a friend of mine (Mordy Ovits - editor of the Knish) about Gil's desire to rename the LWMO as "Post Orthodox" and he suggested a great new name for Modern Orthodoxy - ModernXORthodoxy (you need to be a geek to get it, or Google XOR) - because you can be either Modern OR Orthodox, but not both.

But I think I can go one better than that - since in truth none of us LWMO are really truly modern, nor are we Orthodox, we are in fact Neither Modern OR Orthodox, which would be written as Modern NOR Orthodox, or just ModernNORthodox for short. So next time someone asks you what you are, just say "Me? I'm Modern Northodox of course". They'll be happy, and you don't have to pretend - it's a win-win situation. And also possibly the name of my new blog.

What does Toevah mean in the Torah?

There's been some discussion about what "Toevah" actually means. I thought I would so some research to see for myself.

References to Toevah in the Torah

(If I missed any, please let me know)

1. Breishis 43:32: Regarding Egyptian attitudes towards eating with hebrews

וַיָּשִׂימוּ לוֹ לְבַדּוֹ, וְלָהֶם לְבַדָּם; וְלַמִּצְרִים הָאֹכְלִים אִתּוֹ, לְבַדָּם--כִּי לֹא יוּכְלוּן הַמִּצְרִים לֶאֱכֹל אֶת-הָעִבְרִים לֶחֶם, כִּי-תוֹעֵבָה הִוא לְמִצְרָיִם.

2. Breishis 46:34: Regarding Egyptian attitudes towards being a shepherd

וַאֲמַרְתֶּם, אַנְשֵׁי מִקְנֶה הָיוּ עֲבָדֶיךָ מִנְּעוּרֵינוּ וְעַד-עַתָּה--גַּם-אֲנַחְנוּ, גַּם-אֲבֹתֵינוּ: בַּעֲבוּר, תֵּשְׁבוּ בְּאֶרֶץ גֹּשֶׁן, כִּי-תוֹעֲבַת מִצְרַיִם, כָּל-רֹעֵה צֹאן.

3. Shemos 8:22: Regarding Egyptian attitudes towards sacrificing sheep

וַיֹּאמֶר מֹשֶׁה, לֹא נָכוֹן לַעֲשׂוֹת כֵּן, כִּי תּוֹעֲבַת מִצְרַיִם, נִזְבַּח לַיהוָה אֱלֹהֵינוּ: הֵן נִזְבַּח אֶת-תּוֹעֲבַת מִצְרַיִם, לְעֵינֵיהֶם--וְלֹא יִסְקְלֻנוּ

[Note that the King James Bible translates Vayikrah 7:18 (Pigul) and Vayikrah 11:10, 11:11 etc (Sheretz) as "abomination" too.]

4. Vayikrah 18:22: Regarding Homosexuality

וְאֶת-זָכָר--לֹא תִשְׁכַּב, מִשְׁכְּבֵי אִשָּׁה: תּוֹעֵבָה, הִוא

5. Vayikrah 20:13: Regarding Homosexuality

וְאִישׁ, אֲשֶׁר יִשְׁכַּב אֶת-זָכָר מִשְׁכְּבֵי אִשָּׁה--תּוֹעֵבָה עָשׂוּ, שְׁנֵיהֶם; מוֹת יוּמָתוּ, דְּמֵיהֶם בָּם

6. Devarim 7:25: Regarding idol worship

פְּסִילֵי אֱלֹהֵיהֶם, תִּשְׂרְפוּן בָּאֵשׁ; לֹא-תַחְמֹד כֶּסֶף וְזָהָב עֲלֵיהֶם, וְלָקַחְתָּ לָךְ--פֶּן תִּוָּקֵשׁ בּוֹ, כִּי תוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ הוּא

7. Devarim 7:26 Regarding idol worship

וְלֹא-תָבִיא תוֹעֵבָה אֶל-בֵּיתֶךָ, וְהָיִיתָ חֵרֶם כָּמֹהוּ; שַׁקֵּץ תְּשַׁקְּצֶנּוּ וְתַעֵב תְּתַעֲבֶנּוּ, כִּי-חֵרֶם הוּא

[Interesting - equates "sheketz" and "toevah"]

8. Devarim 12:31: Regarding idol worship

לֹא-תַעֲשֶׂה כֵן, לַיהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ: כִּי כָל-תּוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה אֲשֶׁר שָׂנֵא, עָשׂוּ לֵאלֹהֵיהֶם--כִּי גַם אֶת-בְּנֵיהֶם וְאֶת-בְּנֹתֵיהֶם, יִשְׂרְפוּ בָאֵשׁ לֵאלֹהֵיהֶם

9. Devarim 13:15: Regarding idol worship

וְדָרַשְׁתָּ וְחָקַרְתָּ וְשָׁאַלְתָּ, הֵיטֵב; וְהִנֵּה אֱמֶת נָכוֹן הַדָּבָר, נֶעֶשְׂתָה הַתּוֹעֵבָה הַזֹּאת בְּקִרְבֶּךָ

10. Devarim 17:1: Regarding offering a sacrifice with a blemish

לֹא-תִזְבַּח לַיהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ שׁוֹר וָשֶׂה, אֲשֶׁר יִהְיֶה בוֹ מוּם--כֹּל, דָּבָר רָע: כִּי תוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ, הוּא

11. Devarim 17:4: Regarding idol worship

וְהֻגַּד-לְךָ, וְשָׁמָעְתָּ; וְדָרַשְׁתָּ הֵיטֵב--וְהִנֵּה אֱמֶת נָכוֹן הַדָּבָר, נֶעֶשְׂתָה הַתּוֹעֵבָה הַזֹּאת בְּיִשְׂרָאֵל

12. Devarim 18:9: Regarding not copying the Cannanites e.g. with child sacrifice

כִּי אַתָּה בָּא אֶל-הָאָרֶץ, אֲשֶׁר-יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ נֹתֵן לָךְ--לֹא-תִלְמַד לַעֲשׂוֹת, כְּתוֹעֲבֹת הַגּוֹיִם הָהֵם

13. Devarim 18:12: Same as above

כִּי-תוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה, כָּל-עֹשֵׂה אֵלֶּה; וּבִגְלַל, הַתּוֹעֵבֹת הָאֵלֶּה, יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ, מוֹרִישׁ אוֹתָם מִפָּנֶיךָ

14. Devarim 22:5: Regarding a woman wearing men's clothing or vice versa

לֹא-יִהְיֶה כְלִי-גֶבֶר עַל-אִשָּׁה, וְלֹא-יִלְבַּשׁ גֶּבֶר שִׂמְלַת אִשָּׁה: כִּי תוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ, כָּל-עֹשֵׂה אֵלֶּה

15. Devarim 23:19: Regarding using inappropriate funds for the temple

לֹא-תָבִיא אֶתְנַן זוֹנָה וּמְחִיר כֶּלֶב, בֵּית יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ--לְכָל-נֶדֶר: כִּי תוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ, גַּם-שְׁנֵיהֶם

16. Devarim 24:4: Regarding remarrying your former wife is she has since been married

לֹא-יוּכַל בַּעְלָהּ הָרִאשׁוֹן אֲשֶׁר-שִׁלְּחָהּ לָשׁוּב לְקַחְתָּהּ לִהְיוֹת לוֹ לְאִשָּׁה, אַחֲרֵי אֲשֶׁר הֻטַּמָּאָה--כִּי-תוֹעֵבָה הִוא, לִפְנֵי יְהוָה; וְלֹא תַחֲטִיא, אֶת-הָאָרֶץ, אֲשֶׁר יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ, נֹתֵן לְךָ נַחֲלָה

17. Devarim 25:16: Regarding false weights

כִּי תוֹעֲבַת יְהוָה אֱלֹהֶיךָ, כָּל-עֹשֵׂה אֵלֶּה: כֹּל, עֹשֵׂה עָוֶל

References Summary

3 References to Egyptian attitudes

2 References to Homosexuality (the act)

7 References to Idol Worship

1 Reference to Blemished Sacrifices

1 Reference to Cross dressing

1 Reference to Inappropriate Temple funds

1 Reference to Remarrying former wife

1 Reference to False Weights

Conclusion

The general meaning seems to be abomination / disgusting. Remarrying former wife and cross dressing seem a little tame to warrant such a term, however the meforshim explain that these practices lead to immorality (or maybe are forbidden because traditionally they were specifically practiced in the surrounding cultures to lead to immorality). Not sure why God regards a blemished sacrifice as an abomination, perhaps it demonstrates a lack of respect for God.

Of course, Vayikrah 20:13 is quite explicit about the punishment, so it probably doesn't matter too much what the exact meaning of the word is.

Is Halachic Homosexuality a solution?

An LGBT friend of mine writes:

"LGBT OJ'ers, much like yourself, have ties that bind them to the OJ community in ways that go beyond theology. These are ties to family and communal relationships as well as the shared culture and history that give human life meaning. Queer OJs struggle to maintain their relationships with their parents and children and siblings as well as their religion.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but if someone put forward the same kind of glib position that you did, and said that people that didn't believe in God or TMS or other "pillars" of the faith should just leave orthodoxy because they will never be intellectually honest or fulfilled and their lives will become one big lie, what would your response be? Would you think to yourself, "Sure, there will be some anguish over leaving the comforting religious sect of your childhood, but surely that doesn't compare to the anguish of living your life in the closet, all alone except for other people in your position." Would you not think of your parents, children, family, friends that you've known your whole life, etc? What about what your family would know of you and your disappearance from the family tree? Would you not think of the cultural void that you would face? What about where you will be buried, how you will be a good person, who will remember you, how will you connect with your history and your future cut off from your ancestry, how will your life be meaningful?

OK, some good points in there. However I still maintain that there is absolutely no comparison between an OP and a Frum Gay. The former might get annoyed at some of the stupid fundamentalism he has to put up with, but basically he is free to live a fairly normal life, with perhaps some minor inconveniences. A frum gay on the other hand has to entirely change their lifestyle from what their innermost being says it should be, and deprives themselves of love.

On another note, what good is an OP that recognizes the reality of LGBT experience but does nothing to improve the situation, or for that matter an OP that doesn't take a social justice approach to halacha and communal norms. That kind of OP is so much worse than fundie or intellifundie because it maintains the biases and exclusion of religions without even having a belief in the correctness or authenticity of those biases... It's nothing more than a self-indulgent kiddush club with an intellectual circle jerk...

True. Mea Culpa.

Some of the LGBT OJ folks that believe in OJ have developed halachic ways to have meaningful relationships and families. Some believe that their abstention from one particular sex act can be as religiously meaningful as those frum couples who believe that their is spiritual value in keeping niddah laws. Others do not. And this is speaking nothing of lesbian women, where any prohibitions are sketchy (mostly because the Torah doesn't give women's sexuality much agency).

In any event, studies show that about 1/3 of gay men (in the general population, i.e. not religious gay men) will answer no to the question of whether they have had anal sex, meaning that there is a significant percentage of gay men for whom the deorayta issur doesn't become a factor... Other friends of mine have entered into a shtar for a partnership agreement instead of kiddushin and nissuin. There are ways to deal with the halacha, and these are meaningful to some LGBT OJs. In any event, the policing should be equal for heteros and LGBTs.

The notion of Halachic Homosexuality is an interesting one. By abstaining from one particular act, the Halachic Homosexual (HH) can (justly) claim that he is not violating any serious aveiros, or maybe any aveiros at all. Well, I guess there's probably motzi zera levataoloh - but then that's pretty overblown anyway - someone Chareidi once told me that it's not really even clear that it's so ossur. (But please consult your local Orthodox Rabbi first).

I understand that you think that it would be easier to just leave, but I think that it is tough either way, and for many it's equally difficult to leave and/or to stay and fight... Especially because staying and fighting (or at least fighting from the periphery of the community) may make it easier for the next generation of queer kids that grow up frum and spare them and their families a lot of tzar and anguish. Look how much further along queer issues are in the frum community now then when you were in yeshiva. That did not happen without people sticking around. And people that know better should be at the forefront supporting LGBT inclusion... If someone wants to leave, they will be able to make that choice themselves... You have a choice too, but you have the right to make that decision... Let LGBT folks have the choice too..."

OK. So an HH could feel morally sanctified by abstaining from the certain act, kinda like hilchot niddah for gays. They can get married with a different ceremony and basically live a frum life. And if they attended a LWMO shul, they would be accepted. So maybe it can work? I'm not sure.

Oh My God! Rabbi Riskin said "Rabbi Jesus"!!!

From ej:

"In the future when historians will ask why did Orthodoxy fall apart they will blame the blogs. First they examined the Orthodox ideologies with a microscope, then they exposed the scandals and corrupt underside in detail , then everyone attacked everyone...The best and the brightest spend their time showing how terrible everyone to their right and left really are. I just know that after they get rid of LWMO , YCT and all other potential competitors they will eat their own. There is something about Orthodox culture from one end to the other that is terribly self destructive...people who love to hate and find fault in others."

Sure. It's the narcissism of small differences. It's religious intolerance. It's something to hock about. Basically, much of religious feeling is just the yetzer horoh in good disguise. Luckily I'm Orthoprax, so I mostly don't have to feel any righteous indignation when somebody does something totally beyond the pale, somewhat over the line, or ever so slightly to the left or right of my positions. I can ignore all of that bs in real life.

But I do like to stir it up on the blogs. Mostly just to demonstrate (at least to myself, if no one else) how much bs it all is.

UPDATE: A commenter points out how these kinds of passionate debates about trivialities are very common in any community. It's true, just look at the violent clashes between the Canonites and the Nikonors. Maybe it's just a deep seated human need to argue.

Or more likely, it has something to do with existential angst.

Hirhurim: Trying to force out the LWMO and call them Post-Orthodox

Is anyone following the threads on Hirhurim? Gil is trying to kick out the LWMO from Orthodoxy, and is hoping they'll start calling themselves "Post Orthodox". As he writes:

"I'm hoping the Post-Orthodox term catches on for Left Wing Modern Orthodox. It will solve the problem and reduce the tension within Modern Orthodoxy."

Oh please. Why should the LWMO leave? I have a better idea. Let the RWMO Modern Orthodox start calling themselves Chareidim and be subservient to Rav Elyashiv, and let the Modern Orthodox live up to their name.

Gil also writes:

"LWMO is *not* conventional Orthodoxy. I do not recall any time when women rabbis (or aliyos), openness to homosexuality or compromise on the Sinaitic source of the Torah were up for grabs."

Oh please (again). Modern Orthodoxy isn't conventional either (from an 18th Century Standpoint). Things change. These RWMO'ers want to have their cake and eat it too - they want to challenge all the world's Gedolim (e.g. with Torah and Science), but chas vesholom anyone should challenge them. What a bunch of hypocrites.

If you don't like progress, go be Chareidi.

Also, see here.

Is DovBear Homophobic? UPDATE: No!

I was quite surprised to read the following line from DovBear:

"As a community, Orthodox Jews must discover and agree that homosexuals are potential sinners like all of us."

Potential sinners??!! Why? For wanting to have a relationship with the person they love? Is this what DovBear believes, that practicing gay people are sinners?

Shame on you DovBear.

UPDATE: Turns out that DB thinks there's nothing wrong with gay sex. Boruch Hashem.

Idiodoxy: An idea for a movie

[Hat tip: Idiocracy]

Moshe, in an IDF experiment that goes horribly wrong, wakes up 500 years in the future. He is surrounded by Chareidim. They are spending every waking minute performing hundreds of segulos and kabalistic rituals. He asks whats going on. Turns out the crops have failed and they are desperate. Unfortunately all the chilonim and daatiim leumim have been overwhelmed due to extremely high chareidi propagation rates. There are no more scientists, farmers, or really anyone who knows how to do anything useful. All they know is segulos and shnororing. Moshe, having some worldly knowledge, is quickly proclaimed president in charge of fixing everything. He tries to get them to water the crops rather than davening but they denounce him as a kofer and order him stoned to death. At the last second however a flower grows, so they have a seuudas hodooh. But still, of course, they stone Moshe to death. After all, he was a kofer.

Song for YU Toevanicks

Come out Chananya you shouldn't wait
You YU gays start much too late
There's nothing you can do, it's just fate
You had to be the one

Well, They showed you the Torah, taught you to pray
They took you to Yeshivah and locked you away
But they never told you the price that you'll pay
For things that you might have done
Only the straight stay frum

You might be scared to run with a non Orthodox crowd
But it's your only choice to be gay and proud
You might be a bit too loud
But that never hurt no one

So come on Chananya don't waste your time
Leave the Bes Medrash you'll be just fine
That big gemara you're hiding behind
Never lets in the sun
Only the straight stay frum
Woah
I tell ya
Only the straight stay frum
Only the straight stay frum

You got a nice black hat and a party on your barmitzvatation
You got an extra Shabbos soul
And a Menorah of gold
But Chananya they didn't give you quite enough information
They're not going to be so happy
When they discover your homosexuality
Oh Woe! Woe!

They say there's only heaven for those who are straight
They say it's true but you know it ain't
Better married with the sinners than single with the saints
The sinners will be much more fun...
You know that only the straight stay frum

Thats what I said
I tell ya
Only the straight stay frum
Only the straight stay frum